Community

[CT III]

Why even do a show next year? I get it - because the cast needs money and they will be getting paid a lot of it.

Syndication.

4 seasons' worth of episodes is apparently considered the bare minimum needed these days for M-F syndication to work.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100_episodes

In recent years, the 100-episode milestone for syndication has been lowered to 88 episodes. Shows approaching the 88-episode target are often renewed despite low ratings in order to ensure syndication. Production companies can offer discounts on licensing fees to networks to encourage renewal.

Shows that are approaching the 88-episode syndication milestone but get poor ratings are often moved to graveyard slots on Friday or Saturday in order to burn off remaining episodes.

An extreme example of a show renewed for syndication was 'Til Death. During its third season, 'Til Death was pulled from Fox's lineup in October 2008 after seven episodes due to low ratings. 'Til Death was later renewed for a fourth season after Sony Pictures Entertainment offered Fox a discount on the licensing fee. Unaired episodes from the third season were broadcast alongside fourth season episodes from October 2009 onwards, first on Fridays and later on Sundays. The show eventually reached 81 episodes, enough for off-network syndication.

NBC's 13-episode order for Season 4 (with the possibility of more donuts to come) would bring the show to 84 episodes.

So Sony was probably willing to do whatever it would take to get this one final season, and they would have had little by way of leverage on their own end. It could be that one of NBC's conditions for renewal was that noted clubhouse cancer Dan Harmon would get the axe. It could simply be that NBC forced Sony to take such a severe haircut on Season 4 that they don't believe it would be cost effective to let Harmon continue to run it like the perfectionist he is.

Either way, we're probably left with a show basically running out the clock on the cheap.

My question is: what network is going to syndicate a show like Community?

Comedy Central?

Adult Swim.

[J. Walter Weatherman]

As a fan of the show, I think it sucks that Harmon is gone. I can't imagine it being nearly the same level of weird/funny/genius that it's been for three seasons.

That being said, I also get how being an employee works and it sounds like he's a disaster to work with. Scripts were apparently always late, episodes would run way over budget and he bullied people enough that the staff turned over pretty frequently. And that doesn't even get to him playing the Chevy Chase voicemail at his Harmontown thing, which by itself was probably a fireable offense.

Obviously I'd rather have him stay as the showrunner because none of that stuff affects me personally and I just want good TV. But I can't say that I don't understand why they shipped him off.

You know who else has a long-standing reputation for being impossible to work with? Chevy Chase.

They both seem like total dicks (though Chevy seems to be in a class all his own).

The difference seems to be that, with Harmon, being "difficult to work with" (late scripts, cost overruns, rewriting his writers' scripts) seems to all boil down to obsessive, over-the-top perfectionism (crossed with his alleged Asperger's-like inability to understand or consider others' feelings). Whereas with Chevy it seems to be about a pervasive lack of respect for anyone not named Chevy Chase, which expresses itself as assholism for assholism's sake.

The difference is that Harmon was indispensable, and his dickishness possibly the unfortunate price to pay to make Community the show it's been, while Pierce is barely more essential to the show than his nemesis Vicki.

[J. Walter Weatherman]

Why even do a show next year? I get it - because the cast needs money and they will be getting paid a lot of it.

Syndication.

4 seasons' worth of episodes is apparently considered the bare minimum needed these days for M-F syndication to work.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100_episodes

In recent years, the 100-episode milestone for syndication has been lowered to 88 episodes. Shows approaching the 88-episode target are often renewed despite low ratings in order to ensure syndication. Production companies can offer discounts on licensing fees to networks to encourage renewal.

Shows that are approaching the 88-episode syndication milestone but get poor ratings are often moved to graveyard slots on Friday or Saturday in order to burn off remaining episodes.

An extreme example of a show renewed for syndication was 'Til Death. During its third season, 'Til Death was pulled from Fox's lineup in October 2008 after seven episodes due to low ratings. 'Til Death was later renewed for a fourth season after Sony Pictures Entertainment offered Fox a discount on the licensing fee. Unaired episodes from the third season were broadcast alongside fourth season episodes from October 2009 onwards, first on Fridays and later on Sundays. The show eventually reached 81 episodes, enough for off-network syndication.

NBC's 13-episode order for Season 4 (with the possibility of more donuts to come) would bring the show to 84 episodes.

So Sony was probably willing to do whatever it would take to get this one final season, and they would have had little by way of leverage on their own end. It could be that one of NBC's conditions for renewal was that noted clubhouse cancer Dan Harmon would get the axe. It could simply be that NBC forced Sony to take such a severe haircut on Season 4 that they don't believe it would be cost effective to let Harmon continue to run it like the perfectionist he is.

Either way, we're probably left with a show basically running out the clock on the cheap.

My question is: what network is going to syndicate a show like Community?

Comedy Central?

Adult Swim.

Does Adult Swim currently syndicate any shows from other networks?

[Slaky]

Why even do a show next year? I get it - because the cast needs money and they will be getting paid a lot of it.

Syndication.

4 seasons' worth of episodes is apparently considered the bare minimum needed these days for M-F syndication to work.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100_episodes

In recent years, the 100-episode milestone for syndication has been lowered to 88 episodes. Shows approaching the 88-episode target are often renewed despite low ratings in order to ensure syndication. Production companies can offer discounts on licensing fees to networks to encourage renewal.

Shows that are approaching the 88-episode syndication milestone but get poor ratings are often moved to graveyard slots on Friday or Saturday in order to burn off remaining episodes.

An extreme example of a show renewed for syndication was 'Til Death. During its third season, 'Til Death was pulled from Fox's lineup in October 2008 after seven episodes due to low ratings. 'Til Death was later renewed for a fourth season after Sony Pictures Entertainment offered Fox a discount on the licensing fee. Unaired episodes from the third season were broadcast alongside fourth season episodes from October 2009 onwards, first on Fridays and later on Sundays. The show eventually reached 81 episodes, enough for off-network syndication.

NBC's 13-episode order for Season 4 (with the possibility of more donuts to come) would bring the show to 84 episodes.

So Sony was probably willing to do whatever it would take to get this one final season, and they would have had little by way of leverage on their own end. It could be that one of NBC's conditions for renewal was that noted clubhouse cancer Dan Harmon would get the axe. It could simply be that NBC forced Sony to take such a severe haircut on Season 4 that they don't believe it would be cost effective to let Harmon continue to run it like the perfectionist he is.

Either way, we're probably left with a show basically running out the clock on the cheap.

My question is: what network is going to syndicate a show like Community?

Comedy Central?

Adult Swim.

Does Adult Swim currently syndicate any shows from other networks?

Family Guy, for one. At least they used to.

[CT III]

As a fan of the show, I think it sucks that Harmon is gone. I can't imagine it being nearly the same level of weird/funny/genius that it's been for three seasons.

That being said, I also get how being an employee works and it sounds like he's a disaster to work with. Scripts were apparently always late, episodes would run way over budget and he bullied people enough that the staff turned over pretty frequently. And that doesn't even get to him playing the Chevy Chase voicemail at his Harmontown thing, which by itself was probably a fireable offense.

Obviously I'd rather have him stay as the showrunner because none of that stuff affects me personally and I just want good TV. But I can't say that I don't understand why they shipped him off.

You know who else has a long-standing reputation for being impossible to work with? Chevy Chase.

They both seem like total dicks (though Chevy seems to be in a class all his own).

The difference seems to be that, with Harmon, being "difficult to work with" (late scripts, cost overruns, rewriting his writers' scripts) seems to all boil down to obsessive, over-the-top perfectionism (crossed with his alleged Asperger's-like inability to understand or consider others' feelings). Whereas with Chevy it seems to be about a pervasive lack of respect for anyone not named Chevy Chase, which expresses itself as assholism for assholism's sake.

The difference is that Harmon was indispensable, and his dickishness possibly the unfortunate price to pay to make Community the show it's been, while Pierce is barely more essential to the show than his nemesis Vicki.

Look I think it's a hell of a show, but from NBC's standpoint Harmon can hardly be considered "indispensable".  Much as we like Community, the truth is by Nielson metrics (and I'm not going to debate the validity of the Nielson system - it sucks, but that's what the industry uses) nobody watches the damn thing.  Basically, this is a no-brainer for NBC - they fire Harmon, and maybe his replacement(s) can get the ratings up and make the show viable.  Worst case is the ratings don't go up, the show loses its distinctive voice and wheezes across the 100 episode finish line.

[Eli]

Look I think it's a hell of a show, but from NBC's standpoint Harmon can hardly be considered "indispensable".  Much as we like Community, the truth is by Nielson metrics (and I'm not going to debate the validity of the Nielson system - it sucks, but that's what the industry uses) nobody watches the damn thing.  Basically, this is a no-brainer for NBC - they fire Harmon, and maybe his replacement(s) can get the ratings up and make the show viable.  Worst case is the ratings don't go up, the show loses its distinctive voice and wheezes across the 100 episode finish line.

Yeah, all of this. The NBC higher-ups aren't going to consider him indispensable because he comes up with an episode almost entirely done in 8-bit animation, based mostly around a character who had appeared in one previous episode. The show is totally inaccessible to people who haven't already seen it so they weren't going to pick up any new viewers. And I think Harmon sometimes was almost aggressive about not making the show appeal to a wider audience.

I'm not saying any of this is "right." But I get where NBC and Sony were coming from. No one was watching the damn thing.

[Powdered Toast Man]

Look I think it's a hell of a show, but from NBC's standpoint Harmon can hardly be considered "indispensable".  Much as we like Community, the truth is by Nielson metrics (and I'm not going to debate the validity of the Nielson system - it sucks, but that's what the industry uses) nobody watches the damn thing.  Basically, this is a no-brainer for NBC - they fire Harmon, and maybe his replacement(s) can get the ratings up and make the show viable.  Worst case is the ratings don't go up, the show loses its distinctive voice and wheezes across the 100 episode finish line.

Serious question, what do you mean by "make the show viable"?  As far as I'm concerned, the show is pretty funny and I like it how it is.  Does the new showrunner have to bring in resident doctors and make them have sex in broom closets or make the characters have singing or dancing competitions?

That was my awful attempt at saying Community is an intelligent, color outside the lines type of comedy and America is stupid for not giving it better attention.

However, I am grateful for the Community I've gotten to see over the last couple years and I'd be more than willing to watch the reruns in syndication.

[Gilgamesh]

Look I think it's a hell of a show, but from NBC's standpoint Harmon can hardly be considered "indispensable".  Much as we like Community, the truth is by Nielson metrics (and I'm not going to debate the validity of the Nielson system - it sucks, but that's what the industry uses) nobody watches the damn thing.  Basically, this is a no-brainer for NBC - they fire Harmon, and maybe his replacement(s) can get the ratings up and make the show viable.  Worst case is the ratings don't go up, the show loses its distinctive voice and wheezes across the 100 episode finish line.

Serious question, what do you mean by "make the show viable"?  As far as I'm concerned, the show is pretty funny and I like it how it is.  Does the new showrunner have to bring in resident doctors and make them have sex in broom closets or make the characters have singing or dancing competitions?

That was my awful attempt at saying Community is an intelligent, color outside the lines type of comedy and America is stupid for not giving it better attention.

However, I am grateful for the Community I've gotten to see over the last couple years and I'd be more than willing to watch the reruns in syndication.

It's not just that.  As CT noted, I think NBC would be happy to keep Harmon on the show (and his late scripts, budget overruns, bad attitudes, etc.) if the show were pulling in viewers.  However, that wasn't the case.  And, it appears that Harmon was going out of his way to make the show as core-audience centric as possible rather than attracting new viewers, so for NBC it was really a no-brainer.

That said, I'll still watch it.  Harmon has crafted this show in its own special universe, so any new showrunner is going to have work within the spectrum of character and setting that Harmon made; it'd be incredibly difficult to just reboot the whole show.

[R-V]

Dan Harmon no longer writes for Community but he still occasionally writes at his blog. I'm going to go ahead and spoil the end of this entertaining rant.

http://danharmon.tumblr.com/post/33234881965/i-think-romney-doesnt-actually-want-to-be-president

That was self indulgent and cynical. Well, fuck you, it's a blog. Your refund's in your mom's butt, I'll get it for you Friday night.

[Saul Goodman]

Amaze-dean return.

[Eli]

Amaze-dean return.

Was it? Haven't seen it yet, but I've heard pretty polar-opposite opinions from different sources.

So why am I asking you like you're some definitive source? I guess I could just cancel this post and pretend this never happened but

[Saul Goodman]

Amaze-dean return.

Was it? Haven't seen it yet, but I've heard pretty polar-opposite opinions from different sources.

So why am I asking you like you're some definitive source? I guess I could just cancel this post and pretend this never happened but

Sorry.

Amaze-dean return.

[Gilgamesh]

Amaze-dean return.

Was it? Haven't seen it yet, but I've heard pretty polar-opposite opinions from different sources.

So why am I asking you like you're some definitive source? I guess I could just cancel this post and pretend this never happened but

I watched it last night.  I thought it was too over-the-top in terms of how it approached the change from Harmon, and a little too cute for its own good in other places, but it was still funny.  That being said, I don't think it's likely that this show is going to survive past this abbreviated season. 

Maybe that's for the best.

[Quality Start Machine]

I think they tried to cram too much into 30 minutes (Hunger Games, sitcom, animation) and wound up with a blivot.

Hopefully the rest of the season isn't like this.

[J. Walter Weatherman]

This was kind of unexpected:

NBC has renewed Community as the Joel McHale starrer continues to march toward its "six seasons and a movie."

The beleaguered cult favorite will continue on for a fifth season, NBC announced Friday. The news comes a day after the Thursday comedy wrapped its fourth season, even year-over-year with a 1.3 rating in the advertiser-coveted adults 18-49 demographic and tying American Idol among adults 18-34.

While Community will continue, it will do so without co-star Chevy Chase, who exited the show in November following a roller-coaster relationship with the NBC series as he grew frustrated with the direction his character was taking. Most recently in October, the actor used an N-word on-set when questioning dialog in a scene, then "immediately" apologized to the cast.

The pickup also comes ahead of Community's syndicated debut in the fall on Comedy Central, with repeats potentially helping to lift the series the way TBS' encores have helped push CBS' The Big Bang Theory to new heights in its sixth season.

Despite being initially left off the network's midseason lineup for the second time, the series received a vote of confidence from NBC Entertainment chairman Bob Greenblatt earlier this year when he touted that the community college comedy would have more heart under new showrunners David Guarascio and Moses Port. The duo took over from series creator Dan Harmon this season, with some critics of the Sony Pictures Television vehicle giving season four mixed results, some noting Community had lost the edge it had under Harmon.

For NBC's part, the Community news as the network reinvents its comedy brand, with the community college series joining Parks and Recreation as its lone returning half-hours for 2013-14. All of its freshman comedies -- save for Ryan Murphy's semi-autobiographical entry The New Normal and summer effort Save Me -- have failed to earn second seasons, though Save Me is not expected to return. NBC on Friday dropped Matthew Perry's Go On, which was considered the rookie most likely to continue.

Meanwhile, NBC continues to add new comedies including The Michael J. Fox Show, Sean Saves the World, Undateable and The Family Guide, which just lost co-star Parker Posey.