I admit it...

[Tony]

Can we talk about an offseason that includes getting rid of Miguel Montero?

TPD.  Yes, let's get rid of the .754 OPS catcher who had a largely excellent year behind the plate, was a not insignificant part of Arrieta's season and was clearly an all-round good guy and team-mate, because he missed a wild pitch at what happened to be the worst possible moment.  What's that you say?  The Mets scored two more runs in the next inning anyway?  Pfft... I don't care.  And let's ignore the fact that Montero had earlier prevented a run by nailing Granderson - bailing out Baez in the process - with an inch-perfect throw to second.  Also, let's ignore the fact that Fowler, Rizzo, Bryant, Castro and Baez have gone 10-52 with just two doubles in this series, because Montero is the real fucking problem.

EDIT: While we're at it, let's also forget all the other fucking awful fielding we saw last night, and LaStella's "at-bat", shall we?

To be fair, Montero's complete inability to hit fastballs anymore seems like a problem, and he's old, and likely to decline. I personally hope Schwarber is able to catch a lot more games next year or it could get ugly. Scapegoating him for the loss is dumb, though.

He's been bad for a while. Maybe he's old. Maybe he's still hurt. Maybe his hot start was a fluke. Either was Schwarber probably isn't an outfielder, and can hopefully stick at catcher. I don't know what that means for Miggy. It's not like they can platoon to work Schwarber in.

I legitimately don't know what they're supposed to do with Schwarber defensively. As bad as he's looked in the outfield, he looked worse at catcher.

Trade him? His value isn't going to get any higher.

If the Cubs really don't have a place to play him, other teams will know it. So, I'm not sure the return value on a trade would be as much as we expect if half the teams in baseball aren't going to be heavily involved in the bidding.

I think the best approach is to try to coach him up as much as possible in left field. I still don't love the idea of a guy with his bat getting beaten up and worn down behind the plate all season.

Very much all of this.

However, here's my issue.  If never becomes an even passable LF, he'll have to slug about 650 in order to have a positive value.  We may be looking at a 6 oWAR player with such terrible defensive numbers that he becomes a league average player?  is that even possible?

And with Soler on the other side it makes for a bad outfield defense. Almora will have to be Andruw Jones for it to work.

[SKO]

Can we talk about an offseason that includes getting rid of Miguel Montero?

TPD.  Yes, let's get rid of the .754 OPS catcher who had a largely excellent year behind the plate, was a not insignificant part of Arrieta's season and was clearly an all-round good guy and team-mate, because he missed a wild pitch at what happened to be the worst possible moment.  What's that you say?  The Mets scored two more runs in the next inning anyway?  Pfft... I don't care.  And let's ignore the fact that Montero had earlier prevented a run by nailing Granderson - bailing out Baez in the process - with an inch-perfect throw to second.  Also, let's ignore the fact that Fowler, Rizzo, Bryant, Castro and Baez have gone 10-52 with just two doubles in this series, because Montero is the real fucking problem.

EDIT: While we're at it, let's also forget all the other fucking awful fielding we saw last night, and LaStella's "at-bat", shall we?

To be fair, Montero's complete inability to hit fastballs anymore seems like a problem, and he's old, and likely to decline. I personally hope Schwarber is able to catch a lot more games next year or it could get ugly. Scapegoating him for the loss is dumb, though.

He's been bad for a while. Maybe he's old. Maybe he's still hurt. Maybe his hot start was a fluke. Either was Schwarber probably isn't an outfielder, and can hopefully stick at catcher. I don't know what that means for Miggy. It's not like they can platoon to work Schwarber in.

I legitimately don't know what they're supposed to do with Schwarber defensively. As bad as he's looked in the outfield, he looked worse at catcher.

Trade him? His value isn't going to get any higher.

If the Cubs really don't have a place to play him, other teams will know it. So, I'm not sure the return value on a trade would be as much as we expect if half the teams in baseball aren't going to be heavily involved in the bidding.

I think the best approach is to try to coach him up as much as possible in left field. I still don't love the idea of a guy with his bat getting beaten up and worn down behind the plate all season.

Very much all of this.

However, here's my issue.  If never becomes an even passable LF, he'll have to slug about 650 in order to have a positive value.  We may be looking at a 6 oWAR player with such terrible defensive numbers that he becomes a league average player?  is that even possible?

Fangraphs had him at 1.9 fWAR, which projects out to about 4.5 fWAR over a full season, and that's accounting for his mediocre-to-bad defense at two different positions. I feel like saying he has to slug .650 to be better than average seems a bit extreme.

[Oleg]

Can we talk about an offseason that includes getting rid of Miguel Montero?

TPD.  Yes, let's get rid of the .754 OPS catcher who had a largely excellent year behind the plate, was a not insignificant part of Arrieta's season and was clearly an all-round good guy and team-mate, because he missed a wild pitch at what happened to be the worst possible moment.  What's that you say?  The Mets scored two more runs in the next inning anyway?  Pfft... I don't care.  And let's ignore the fact that Montero had earlier prevented a run by nailing Granderson - bailing out Baez in the process - with an inch-perfect throw to second.  Also, let's ignore the fact that Fowler, Rizzo, Bryant, Castro and Baez have gone 10-52 with just two doubles in this series, because Montero is the real fucking problem.

EDIT: While we're at it, let's also forget all the other fucking awful fielding we saw last night, and LaStella's "at-bat", shall we?

To be fair, Montero's complete inability to hit fastballs anymore seems like a problem, and he's old, and likely to decline. I personally hope Schwarber is able to catch a lot more games next year or it could get ugly. Scapegoating him for the loss is dumb, though.

He's been bad for a while. Maybe he's old. Maybe he's still hurt. Maybe his hot start was a fluke. Either was Schwarber probably isn't an outfielder, and can hopefully stick at catcher. I don't know what that means for Miggy. It's not like they can platoon to work Schwarber in.

I legitimately don't know what they're supposed to do with Schwarber defensively. As bad as he's looked in the outfield, he looked worse at catcher.

Trade him? His value isn't going to get any higher.

If the Cubs really don't have a place to play him, other teams will know it. So, I'm not sure the return value on a trade would be as much as we expect if half the teams in baseball aren't going to be heavily involved in the bidding.

I think the best approach is to try to coach him up as much as possible in left field. I still don't love the idea of a guy with his bat getting beaten up and worn down behind the plate all season.

Very much all of this.

However, here's my issue.  If never becomes an even passable LF, he'll have to slug about 650 in order to have a positive value.  We may be looking at a 6 oWAR player with such terrible defensive numbers that he becomes a league average player?  is that even possible?

Fangraphs had him at 1.9 fWAR, which projects out to about 4.5 fWAR over a full season, and that's accounting for his mediocre-to-bad defense at two different positions. I feel like saying he has to slug .650 to be better than average seems a bit extreme.

Yeah, you're probably right.  Funny thing...his BABIP this year was only .293.  That's seems low for him.

[SKO]

Can we talk about an offseason that includes getting rid of Miguel Montero?

TPD.  Yes, let's get rid of the .754 OPS catcher who had a largely excellent year behind the plate, was a not insignificant part of Arrieta's season and was clearly an all-round good guy and team-mate, because he missed a wild pitch at what happened to be the worst possible moment.  What's that you say?  The Mets scored two more runs in the next inning anyway?  Pfft... I don't care.  And let's ignore the fact that Montero had earlier prevented a run by nailing Granderson - bailing out Baez in the process - with an inch-perfect throw to second.  Also, let's ignore the fact that Fowler, Rizzo, Bryant, Castro and Baez have gone 10-52 with just two doubles in this series, because Montero is the real fucking problem.

EDIT: While we're at it, let's also forget all the other fucking awful fielding we saw last night, and LaStella's "at-bat", shall we?

To be fair, Montero's complete inability to hit fastballs anymore seems like a problem, and he's old, and likely to decline. I personally hope Schwarber is able to catch a lot more games next year or it could get ugly. Scapegoating him for the loss is dumb, though.

He's been bad for a while. Maybe he's old. Maybe he's still hurt. Maybe his hot start was a fluke. Either was Schwarber probably isn't an outfielder, and can hopefully stick at catcher. I don't know what that means for Miggy. It's not like they can platoon to work Schwarber in.

I legitimately don't know what they're supposed to do with Schwarber defensively. As bad as he's looked in the outfield, he looked worse at catcher.

Trade him? His value isn't going to get any higher.

If the Cubs really don't have a place to play him, other teams will know it. So, I'm not sure the return value on a trade would be as much as we expect if half the teams in baseball aren't going to be heavily involved in the bidding.

I think the best approach is to try to coach him up as much as possible in left field. I still don't love the idea of a guy with his bat getting beaten up and worn down behind the plate all season.

Very much all of this.

However, here's my issue.  If never becomes an even passable LF, he'll have to slug about 650 in order to have a positive value.  We may be looking at a 6 oWAR player with such terrible defensive numbers that he becomes a league average player?  is that even possible?

Fangraphs had him at 1.9 fWAR, which projects out to about 4.5 fWAR over a full season, and that's accounting for his mediocre-to-bad defense at two different positions. I feel like saying he has to slug .650 to be better than average seems a bit extreme.

Yeah, you're probably right.  Funny thing...his BABIP this year was only .293.  That's seems low for him.

Yeah, not hard to see him being slightly better (at least fundamentally) in left field next year while potentially being better overall offensively. He may not keep up the 50 homer pace or whatever but I would expect to see significant bumps in his average and a decrease in strikeouts. It might be heresy but honestly given the fact that he's done some shit this year as a rookie that only Pujols has done before I don't think it's insane to think he might be that caliber of hitter long term. Just an absolute monster.

[Oleg]

Can we talk about an offseason that includes getting rid of Miguel Montero?

TPD.  Yes, let's get rid of the .754 OPS catcher who had a largely excellent year behind the plate, was a not insignificant part of Arrieta's season and was clearly an all-round good guy and team-mate, because he missed a wild pitch at what happened to be the worst possible moment.  What's that you say?  The Mets scored two more runs in the next inning anyway?  Pfft... I don't care.  And let's ignore the fact that Montero had earlier prevented a run by nailing Granderson - bailing out Baez in the process - with an inch-perfect throw to second.  Also, let's ignore the fact that Fowler, Rizzo, Bryant, Castro and Baez have gone 10-52 with just two doubles in this series, because Montero is the real fucking problem.

EDIT: While we're at it, let's also forget all the other fucking awful fielding we saw last night, and LaStella's "at-bat", shall we?

To be fair, Montero's complete inability to hit fastballs anymore seems like a problem, and he's old, and likely to decline. I personally hope Schwarber is able to catch a lot more games next year or it could get ugly. Scapegoating him for the loss is dumb, though.

He's been bad for a while. Maybe he's old. Maybe he's still hurt. Maybe his hot start was a fluke. Either was Schwarber probably isn't an outfielder, and can hopefully stick at catcher. I don't know what that means for Miggy. It's not like they can platoon to work Schwarber in.

I legitimately don't know what they're supposed to do with Schwarber defensively. As bad as he's looked in the outfield, he looked worse at catcher.

Trade him? His value isn't going to get any higher.

If the Cubs really don't have a place to play him, other teams will know it. So, I'm not sure the return value on a trade would be as much as we expect if half the teams in baseball aren't going to be heavily involved in the bidding.

I think the best approach is to try to coach him up as much as possible in left field. I still don't love the idea of a guy with his bat getting beaten up and worn down behind the plate all season.

Very much all of this.

However, here's my issue.  If never becomes an even passable LF, he'll have to slug about 650 in order to have a positive value.  We may be looking at a 6 oWAR player with such terrible defensive numbers that he becomes a league average player?  is that even possible?

Fangraphs had him at 1.9 fWAR, which projects out to about 4.5 fWAR over a full season, and that's accounting for his mediocre-to-bad defense at two different positions. I feel like saying he has to slug .650 to be better than average seems a bit extreme.

Yeah, you're probably right.  Funny thing...his BABIP this year was only .293.  That's seems low for him.

Yeah, not hard to see him being slightly better (at least fundamentally) in left field next year while potentially being better overall offensively. He may not keep up the 50 homer pace or whatever but I would expect to see significant bumps in his average and a decrease in strikeouts. It might be heresy but honestly given the fact that he's done some shit this year as a rookie that only Pujols has done before I don't think it's insane to think he might be that caliber of hitter long term. Just an absolute monster.

He also (only) slugged .487 this year.  I'll wait to see what PECOTA and other projections think but I don't think his home runs will turn into outs, even if he's not on a 50 home run pace next year.  Is 75 XBH possible, while getting on base 35% of the time?  Yeah, if he's a 5 win player, I guess that's all right.

[SKO]

Very much all of this.

However, here's my issue.  If never becomes an even passable LF, he'll have to slug about 650 in order to have a positive value.  We may be looking at a 6 oWAR player with such terrible defensive numbers that he becomes a league average player?  is that even possible?

Fangraphs had him at 1.9 fWAR, which projects out to about 4.5 fWAR over a full season, and that's accounting for his mediocre-to-bad defense at two different positions. I feel like saying he has to slug .650 to be better than average seems a bit extreme.

Yeah, you're probably right.  Funny thing...his BABIP this year was only .293.  That's seems low for him.

Yeah, not hard to see him being slightly better (at least fundamentally) in left field next year while potentially being better overall offensively. He may not keep up the 50 homer pace or whatever but I would expect to see significant bumps in his average and a decrease in strikeouts. It might be heresy but honestly given the fact that he's done some shit this year as a rookie that only Pujols has done before I don't think it's insane to think he might be that caliber of hitter long term. Just an absolute monster.

He also (only) slugged .487 this year.  I'll wait to see what PECOTA and other projections think but I don't think his home runs will turn into outs, even if he's not on a 50 home run pace next year.  Is 75 XBH possible, while getting on base 35% of the time?  Yeah, if he's a 5 win player, I guess that's all right.

He hit a wall in September and struck out a lot on those high fastballs and I think the playoffs showed he has adjusted to that. I think if his K rate of 28% trends back down toward what he did in the minors (20%) he'll see a spike in his average even if he doesn't keep up the absurd home run pace. Either way he's a goddamn monster and he shouldn't be traded because Tony is sad right now.

[Chuck to Chuck]

...I'm really not emotionally invested in this round of playoffs.  No idea why. Maybe because it feels like it's house money on the table I've already pulled a shitload of winnings off the board.

[SKO]

...I'm really not emotionally invested in this round of playoffs.  No idea why. Maybe because it feels like it's house money on the table I've already pulled a shitload of winnings off the board.

It's because you don't actually like the Cubs or sports.

[Tony]

Very much all of this.

However, here's my issue.  If never becomes an even passable LF, he'll have to slug about 650 in order to have a positive value.  We may be looking at a 6 oWAR player with such terrible defensive numbers that he becomes a league average player?  is that even possible?

Fangraphs had him at 1.9 fWAR, which projects out to about 4.5 fWAR over a full season, and that's accounting for his mediocre-to-bad defense at two different positions. I feel like saying he has to slug .650 to be better than average seems a bit extreme.

Yeah, you're probably right.  Funny thing...his BABIP this year was only .293.  That's seems low for him.

Yeah, not hard to see him being slightly better (at least fundamentally) in left field next year while potentially being better overall offensively. He may not keep up the 50 homer pace or whatever but I would expect to see significant bumps in his average and a decrease in strikeouts. It might be heresy but honestly given the fact that he's done some shit this year as a rookie that only Pujols has done before I don't think it's insane to think he might be that caliber of hitter long term. Just an absolute monster.

He also (only) slugged .487 this year.  I'll wait to see what PECOTA and other projections think but I don't think his home runs will turn into outs, even if he's not on a 50 home run pace next year.  Is 75 XBH possible, while getting on base 35% of the time?  Yeah, if he's a 5 win player, I guess that's all right.

He hit a wall in September and struck out a lot on those high fastballs and I think the playoffs showed he has adjusted to that. I think if his K rate of 28% trends back down toward what he did in the minors (20%) he'll see a spike in his average even if he doesn't keep up the absurd home run pace. Either way he's a goddamn monster and he shouldn't be traded because Tony is sad right now.

It's a good thing I'm not GM, especially when I'm sad. Not that happy Tony would be any better.

[Quality Start Machine]

...I'm really not emotionally invested in this round of playoffs.  No idea why. Maybe because it feels like it's house money on the table I've already pulled a shitload of winnings off the board.

Feeling like it's house money doesn't mean lack of emotional attachment, at least for me. Just not any angst. I mean, whatever happens from here on out, even if it's a disappointment, the 2015 season has to be graded as successful.

Doesn't mean I want it to end. It's been a fucking blast.

[PenFoe]

...I'm really not emotionally invested in this round of playoffs.  No idea why. Maybe because it feels like it's house money on the table I've already pulled a shitload of winnings off the board.

While I am still very happy with where this season is and where the next five to 6 seasons appear to be going, I'm not going to be in the SKO shed-a-tear place without four more wins. I remember 1984 all too well and thinking it was going to be a good ride again in 1985 and 1986.  I thought the same in 1989.

When we got to 2003, I remember thinking, "It took them 19 years to crush me again?"

It's been 12 more years.  I'm happy.  I'm not satisfied.  And I'm not counting on next year if this doesn't pan out.

Win this fucking thing.

[Chuck to Chuck]

...I'm really not emotionally invested in this round of playoffs.  No idea why. Maybe because it feels like it's house money on the table I've already pulled a shitload of winnings off the board.

While I am still very happy with where this season is and where the next five to 6 seasons appear to be going, I'm not going to be in the SKO shed-a-tear place without four more wins. I remember 1984 all too well and thinking it was going to be a good ride again in 1985 and 1986.  I thought the same in 1989.

When we got to 2003, I remember thinking, "It took them 19 years to crush me again?"

It's been 12 more years.  I'm happy.  I'm not satisfied.  And I'm not counting on next year if this doesn't pan out.

Win this fucking thing.

Yeah, I was thinking about that.  I guess the euphoria of the moment of the win over the Cardinals faded.  I'm in Fork's camp.  This has been great, I don't want it to end, but I'm not going to be upset if it does end without 4 wins in a row.  I'm still not satisfied, but my expectations are just different.

Maybe it's a defense mechanism to avoid the "feeling crushed" again part.  I dunno, but for whatever reason, if this series ends badly, I'm not going to let that crush the fun that was the sum total of this year's results.

[Chuck to Chuck]

...I wanted Lester to start tonight to have him available for a Game 7 Start.

[Brownie]

...I wanted Lester to start tonight to have him available for a Game 7 Start.

I agree.

[CBStew]

...I'm really not emotionally invested in this round of playoffs.  No idea why. Maybe because it feels like it's house money on the table I've already pulled a shitload of winnings off the board.

Feeling like it's house money doesn't mean lack of emotional attachment, at least for me. Just not any angst. I mean, whatever happens from here on out, even if it's a disappointment, the 2015 season has to be graded as successful.

Doesn't mean I want it to end. It's been a fucking blast.

I wish I could agree.  I never got excited about the accomplishments of this season.  Maybe what happened in '84 has subconsciously caused me to not get in too deep.  I hate to think that I am just another jaded Cub fan, but I guess that I am.  Last night I remembered that I have a Las Vegas ticket at 12 to one that my son bought for me last Winter.  I was going to turn the proceeds back to him as his inheritance.  Now I will have to leave him that ugly lamp that we inherited from my mother-in-law.