Fuck its silent in here.......

[SKO]

So was Israel justified in doing what they did?

I don't think either side holds a particularly high moral ground in any of these issues. Kill 'em all and let God sort 'em out

Papa SKO'd.

[Oleg]

So was Israel justified in doing what they did?

I don't think either side holds a particularly high moral ground in any of these issues.

Yep.  This is about right.

Part of the issue is that the Israeli blockade is causing suffering.  However, it's about he only thing they can do for their security.  Both sides have blood on their hands and they can both go fuck themselves.

[Slaky]

So was Israel justified in doing what they did?

I don't think either side holds a particularly high moral ground in any of these issues.

Yep.  This is about right.

Part of the issue is that the Israeli blockade is causing suffering.  However, it's about he only thing they can do for their security.  Both sides have blood on their hands and they can both go fuck themselves.

I agree with all of this. So everyone screaming for justice is full of shit.

Though it's nice to hear my wife's uneducated Norwegian friends blame America for all of this.

[SKO]

So was Israel justified in doing what they did?

I don't think either side holds a particularly high moral ground in any of these issues.

Yep.  This is about right.

Part of the issue is that the Israeli blockade is causing suffering.  However, it's about he only thing they can do for their security.  Both sides have blood on their hands and they can both go fuck themselves.

Holy shit, THIS.

[powen01]

So was Israel justified in doing what they did?

I don't think either side holds a particularly high moral ground in any of these issues.

Yep.  This is about right.

Part of the issue is that the Israeli blockade is causing suffering.  However, it's about he only thing they can do for their security.  Both sides have blood on their hands and they can both go fuck themselves.

I agree with all of this. So everyone screaming for justice is full of shit.

Though it's nice to hear my wife's uneducated Norwegian friends blame America for all of this.

How are Norwegians uneducated?  Aren't they all socialists or something?  C'MON!

[Gilgamesh]

So was Israel justified in doing what they did?

I don't think either side holds a particularly high moral ground in any of these issues.

Yep.  This is about right.

Part of the issue is that the Israeli blockade is causing suffering.  However, it's about he only thing they can do for their security.  Both sides have blood on their hands and they can both go fuck themselves.

I endorse this comment.

[MikeC]

Well lets see, the flotilla was funded by a terrorist organization. Israel gives thousands of tons of aid to Gaza, and offered to transfer whatever the flotilla was transporting to Gaza themselves as long as they got to inspect the cargo.

The Turkish IHH (Islan Haklary Ve Hurriyetleri Vakfi in Turkish) was founded in 1992, and reportedly popped up on the CIA's radar in 1996 for its radical Islamist leanings.  Like many other Islamist charities, the IHH has a record of providing relief to areas where disaster has struck in the Muslim world.

However, the organization is not a force for good. The Turkish nonprofit belongs to a Saudi-based umbrella organization known to finance terrorism called the Union of Good (Ittilaf al-Kheir in Arabic). Notably, the Union is chaired by Sheikh Yusuf Qaradawi, who is known best for his religious ruling that encourages suicide attacks against Israeli civilians.  According to one report, Qardawi personally transferred millions of dollars to the Union in an effort to provide financial support to Hamas.

In 2008, the Israelis banned IHH, along with 35 other Islamist charities worldwide, for its ties to the Union of Good.  This was a follow-on designation; Israelis first blocked the Union of Good from operating in the West Bank and Gaza in 2002. 

Interestingly, the Union of Good may not only be tied to Hamas. Included in the Israeli list of 36 designees was the International Islamic Relief Organization (IIRO).  In 2006, both the U.S. government and the United Nations designated the IIRO branch offices in Indonesia and the Philippines for financing al Qaeda.  French magistrate Jean-Louis Brougiere also testified that IHH had an "important role" in Ahmed Ressam's failed "millennium plot" to bomb the Los Angeles airport in late 1999.

Terrorist funded voyage embarks towards Israel and Israel should do nothing? The first wave of soldiers on the boat were armed with paint ball guns and they were being thrown from the upper decks, beaten with bats and shot at. The second wave of soldiers came fully armed and put and end to that non-sense. They wanted a confrontation and they got it, its suicide by Israeli commando. Its no different than srtapping a bomb to their chest and blowing themselves up. They were put on that boat fully expecting to have people killed.

[powen01]

Well lets see, the flotilla was funded by a terrorist organization. Israel gives thousands of tons of aid to Gaza, and offered to transfer whatever the flotilla was transporting to Gaza themselves as long as they got to inspect the cargo.

The Turkish IHH (Islan Haklary Ve Hurriyetleri Vakfi in Turkish) was founded in 1992, and reportedly popped up on the CIA's radar in 1996 for its radical Islamist leanings.  Like many other Islamist charities, the IHH has a record of providing relief to areas where disaster has struck in the Muslim world.

However, the organization is not a force for good. The Turkish nonprofit belongs to a Saudi-based umbrella organization known to finance terrorism called the Union of Good (Ittilaf al-Kheir in Arabic). Notably, the Union is chaired by Sheikh Yusuf Qaradawi, who is known best for his religious ruling that encourages suicide attacks against Israeli civilians.  According to one report, Qardawi personally transferred millions of dollars to the Union in an effort to provide financial support to Hamas.

In 2008, the Israelis banned IHH, along with 35 other Islamist charities worldwide, for its ties to the Union of Good.  This was a follow-on designation; Israelis first blocked the Union of Good from operating in the West Bank and Gaza in 2002. 

Interestingly, the Union of Good may not only be tied to Hamas. Included in the Israeli list of 36 designees was the International Islamic Relief Organization (IIRO).  In 2006, both the U.S. government and the United Nations designated the IIRO branch offices in Indonesia and the Philippines for financing al Qaeda.  French magistrate Jean-Louis Brougiere also testified that IHH had an "important role" in Ahmed Ressam's failed "millennium plot" to bomb the Los Angeles airport in late 1999.

Terrorist funded voyage embarks towards Israel and Israel should do nothing? The first wave of soldiers on the boat were armed with paint ball guns and they were being thrown from the upper decks, beaten with bats and shot at. The second wave of soldiers came fully armed and put and end to that non-sense. They wanted a confrontation and they got it, its suicide by Israeli commando. Its no different than srtapping a bomb to their chest and blowing themselves up. They were put on that boat fully expecting to have people killed.

... Except that suicide by Israeli commando plays a lot better in some sectors of the international press.

[Gilgamesh]

Well lets see, the flotilla was funded by a terrorist organization. Israel gives thousands of tons of aid to Gaza, and offered to transfer whatever the flotilla was transporting to Gaza themselves as long as they got to inspect the cargo.

The Turkish IHH (Islan Haklary Ve Hurriyetleri Vakfi in Turkish) was founded in 1992, and reportedly popped up on the CIA's radar in 1996 for its radical Islamist leanings.  Like many other Islamist charities, the IHH has a record of providing relief to areas where disaster has struck in the Muslim world.

However, the organization is not a force for good. The Turkish nonprofit belongs to a Saudi-based umbrella organization known to finance terrorism called the Union of Good (Ittilaf al-Kheir in Arabic). Notably, the Union is chaired by Sheikh Yusuf Qaradawi, who is known best for his religious ruling that encourages suicide attacks against Israeli civilians.  According to one report, Qardawi personally transferred millions of dollars to the Union in an effort to provide financial support to Hamas.

In 2008, the Israelis banned IHH, along with 35 other Islamist charities worldwide, for its ties to the Union of Good.  This was a follow-on designation; Israelis first blocked the Union of Good from operating in the West Bank and Gaza in 2002. 

Interestingly, the Union of Good may not only be tied to Hamas. Included in the Israeli list of 36 designees was the International Islamic Relief Organization (IIRO).  In 2006, both the U.S. government and the United Nations designated the IIRO branch offices in Indonesia and the Philippines for financing al Qaeda.  French magistrate Jean-Louis Brougiere also testified that IHH had an "important role" in Ahmed Ressam's failed "millennium plot" to bomb the Los Angeles airport in late 1999.

Terrorist funded voyage embarks towards Israel and Israel should do nothing? The first wave of soldiers on the boat were armed with paint ball guns and they were being thrown from the upper decks, beaten with bats and shot at. The second wave of soldiers came fully armed and put and end to that non-sense. They wanted a confrontation and they got it, its suicide by Israeli commando. Its no different than srtapping a bomb to their chest and blowing themselves up. They were put on that boat fully expecting to have people killed.

... Except that suicide by Israeli commando plays a lot better in some sectors of the international press.

MikeC endorses the execution of Americans by foreign governments.  Got it.

[Chuck to Chuck]

MikeC endorses the execution of Americans by foreign governments.  Got it.

When that happens, we can ask Mike for his endorsement.

[Slaky]

So was Israel justified in doing what they did?

I don't think either side holds a particularly high moral ground in any of these issues.

Yep.  This is about right.

Part of the issue is that the Israeli blockade is causing suffering.  However, it's about he only thing they can do for their security.  Both sides have blood on their hands and they can both go fuck themselves.

I agree with all of this. So everyone screaming for justice is full of shit.

Though it's nice to hear my wife's uneducated Norwegian friends blame America for all of this.

How are Norwegians uneducated?  Aren't they all socialists or something?  C'MON!

Up north they lay around in their parents' log cabins after graduating high school and sling uninformed opinions about the world outside their own miserable existence.

[MikeC]

Well lets see, the flotilla was funded by a terrorist organization. Israel gives thousands of tons of aid to Gaza, and offered to transfer whatever the flotilla was transporting to Gaza themselves as long as they got to inspect the cargo.

The Turkish IHH (Islan Haklary Ve Hurriyetleri Vakfi in Turkish) was founded in 1992, and reportedly popped up on the CIA's radar in 1996 for its radical Islamist leanings.  Like many other Islamist charities, the IHH has a record of providing relief to areas where disaster has struck in the Muslim world.

However, the organization is not a force for good. The Turkish nonprofit belongs to a Saudi-based umbrella organization known to finance terrorism called the Union of Good (Ittilaf al-Kheir in Arabic). Notably, the Union is chaired by Sheikh Yusuf Qaradawi, who is known best for his religious ruling that encourages suicide attacks against Israeli civilians.  According to one report, Qardawi personally transferred millions of dollars to the Union in an effort to provide financial support to Hamas.

In 2008, the Israelis banned IHH, along with 35 other Islamist charities worldwide, for its ties to the Union of Good.  This was a follow-on designation; Israelis first blocked the Union of Good from operating in the West Bank and Gaza in 2002.  

Interestingly, the Union of Good may not only be tied to Hamas. Included in the Israeli list of 36 designees was the International Islamic Relief Organization (IIRO).  In 2006, both the U.S. government and the United Nations designated the IIRO branch offices in Indonesia and the Philippines for financing al Qaeda.  French magistrate Jean-Louis Brougiere also testified that IHH had an "important role" in Ahmed Ressam's failed "millennium plot" to bomb the Los Angeles airport in late 1999.

Terrorist funded voyage embarks towards Israel and Israel should do nothing? The first wave of soldiers on the boat were armed with paint ball guns and they were being thrown from the upper decks, beaten with bats and shot at. The second wave of soldiers came fully armed and put and end to that non-sense. They wanted a confrontation and they got it, its suicide by Israeli commando. Its no different than srtapping a bomb to their chest and blowing themselves up. They were put on that boat fully expecting to have people killed.

... Except that suicide by Israeli commando plays a lot better in some sectors of the international press.

MikeC endorses the execution of Americans by foreign governments.  Got it.

Yes, they really should have stopped and checked ID's before shooting. it would have been an SNL skit they could put on TV...

Israeli Commando #1: (sitting in helicopter) Man they are getting whacked real good down there, quick someone radio the first team to demand to see ID's that should calm the situation down.

Helicopter pilot: GO!

2nd wave lands on deck.

Commando #1: Sir, please stop hitting my friend and show us your ID.

Commando #2: I really don't think he is listening

Commando #1: Ok hold my gun i am gonna go help my friend.

Ahhhh crap there is more of them quick tell them to show ID!! Tell them to show ID!!!!!

Commando #1 now getting the crap kicked out of him.

Commando #2: I would shoot them to get them off you, but i might shoot an American, sorry bud your SOL.

Commando #2 calls HQ: Ahhhh yeah we need a citizen check on an alleged terrorist, i don't know, kinda 5'5" swinging a lousiville slugger, kinda has a really nice uppercut swing to it.....how copy over?

HQ: Do you have a name?

Commando #2: Wait one, i think he is getting tired, i could probably shoot him a question in between swings.

HQ: Copy....take your time.

[Dr. Nguyen Van Falk]

That's 22 minutes and 41 seconds of your life put to good use there, Comar.

[Gilgamesh]

Well lets see, the flotilla was funded by a terrorist organization. Israel gives thousands of tons of aid to Gaza, and offered to transfer whatever the flotilla was transporting to Gaza themselves as long as they got to inspect the cargo.

The Turkish IHH (Islan Haklary Ve Hurriyetleri Vakfi in Turkish) was founded in 1992, and reportedly popped up on the CIA's radar in 1996 for its radical Islamist leanings.  Like many other Islamist charities, the IHH has a record of providing relief to areas where disaster has struck in the Muslim world.

However, the organization is not a force for good. The Turkish nonprofit belongs to a Saudi-based umbrella organization known to finance terrorism called the Union of Good (Ittilaf al-Kheir in Arabic). Notably, the Union is chaired by Sheikh Yusuf Qaradawi, who is known best for his religious ruling that encourages suicide attacks against Israeli civilians.  According to one report, Qardawi personally transferred millions of dollars to the Union in an effort to provide financial support to Hamas.

In 2008, the Israelis banned IHH, along with 35 other Islamist charities worldwide, for its ties to the Union of Good.  This was a follow-on designation; Israelis first blocked the Union of Good from operating in the West Bank and Gaza in 2002.  

Interestingly, the Union of Good may not only be tied to Hamas. Included in the Israeli list of 36 designees was the International Islamic Relief Organization (IIRO).  In 2006, both the U.S. government and the United Nations designated the IIRO branch offices in Indonesia and the Philippines for financing al Qaeda.  French magistrate Jean-Louis Brougiere also testified that IHH had an "important role" in Ahmed Ressam's failed "millennium plot" to bomb the Los Angeles airport in late 1999.

Terrorist funded voyage embarks towards Israel and Israel should do nothing? The first wave of soldiers on the boat were armed with paint ball guns and they were being thrown from the upper decks, beaten with bats and shot at. The second wave of soldiers came fully armed and put and end to that non-sense. They wanted a confrontation and they got it, its suicide by Israeli commando. Its no different than srtapping a bomb to their chest and blowing themselves up. They were put on that boat fully expecting to have people killed.

... Except that suicide by Israeli commando plays a lot better in some sectors of the international press.

MikeC endorses the execution of Americans by foreign governments.  Got it.

Yes, they really should have stopped and checked ID's before shooting. it would have been an SNL skit they could put on TV...

Israeli Commando #1: (sitting in helicopter) Man they are getting whacked real good down there, quick someone radio the first team to demand to see ID's that should calm the situation down.

Helicopter pilot: GO!

2nd wave lands on deck.

Commando #1: Sir, please stop hitting my friend and show us your ID.

Commando #2: I really don't think he is listening

Commando #1: Ok hold my gun i am gonna go help my friend.

Ahhhh crap there is more of them quick tell them to show ID!! Tell them to show ID!!!!!

Commando #1 now getting the crap kicked out of him.

Commando #2: I would shoot them to get them off you, but i might shoot an American, sorry bud your SOL.

Commando #2 calls HQ: Ahhhh yeah we need a citizen check on an alleged terrorist, i don't know, kinda 5'5" swinging a lousiville slugger, kinda has a really nice uppercut swing to it.....how copy over?

HQ: Do you have a name?

Commando #2: Wait one, i think he is getting tired, i could probably shoot him a question in between swings.

HQ: Copy....take your time.

I get it Mike; he wasn't a "real" American anyway.

ISRAEL, FUCK YEAH!!!

[MikeC]

 I am just trying to understand why it matters if he was American or not? Turkish citizens were killed also, but who cares they weren't Americans and they were funded by Terrorists anyways right? But ohhhhhhhh if an American was shot doing the same thing, it changes the whole thing, its now state funded EXECUTION!

Uhhhh no its not, it doesn't matter what his nationality was/is, he boarded a terrorist cruise with a mission of confrontation and he got killed in the process. He doesn't get any extra rights or privileges, or protected status simply because of his citizenship. It's even more silly to feign outrage at the American killed for being part of this whole shame knowing full well what the intended consequences could very well be.

All your saying is, the American could do whatever he wanted, simply because he was American, and the Israeli soldiers could not stop him because he was American. Thats a ridiculous stance to take. But that goes back to the original point, you would then need to stop people in the midst of the attack to check citizenship before you could deal with them in the proper "American" way.

I am sorry but your looking it from a after the fact point of view, and assuming that every single passenger on the ship was identified and full background checks were performed before the raid. It wasn't like a video game where he had a shiny american flag avatar over his head to let everyone know that he was American. And even if he did, it doesn't save him from getting shot if he was attacking soldiers. He could be painted red white and blue and the commandos would still drop him in a heartbeat.