Cubs' Prospects FUTUREBONER thread

[PenFoe]

Baseball America's top 100 prospects released last night.  

5. Baez
8. Bryant
28. Edwards
36. Almora
41. Soler
87. Pierce Johnson
100. Alcantara

Hoping history doesn't repeat itself...

2. Corey Patterson
17.  Juan Cruz
22. Hee Seop Choi
37.  Ben Christiansen
68.  Carlos Zambrano
73. Luis Montanez

You people have fucking problems.

Huey was expressing a hope. What's wrong with that?

I realize I'm talking out of both sides of my mouth.  I just couldn't resist trolling Pen's optimism.  I am optimistic about Epstein's regime getting this franchise on the right  track; but at the same time I confess to being a little weary about these fancy statfaggy prospect projections, the flameouts of the 2001 prospects (Zambrano excepted) leaving me a little scarred.  In the end, I'm subverting my skepticism to Theo dongchuggery.

You know that was 13 years ago, right? 
Under a totally different regime? 

Also, 4 of those 6 guys in 2001 played fairly significant roles on a team that was 5 outs from the World Series two years later.

Admittedly, Juan Cruz's significant role was mostly to be shitty. 

Boy that's really a stretch.  

Choi was opening day first baseman but contributed basically nothing to the team's success after getting bonked on the head in the legendary Wood/Clemens interleague game...in June.  He accrued 71 Plate Appearances the rest of the way as his position was manned by Eric Karros and Randall Simon the last 3 months of the season.

Pattersons' season ended in July 6th, and his position was manned by Kenny Lofton.

Cruz made a whopping nine appearances from June 1st through the end of the year after having been banished out of the rotation in favor of pitchers who didn't suck.  He also hurled a whole inning against Atlanta in the postseason.

I think it's fair to say, in fact, that had centerfield been manned by Patterson--who was probably due for a regression similar to the one he did enjoy in September of 2004--and 1st base by Choi, rather than Lofton and Karros/Simon respctively, that the Cubs would not have made the playoffs (let alone come with 5 outs of the pennant)

And the difference in regime and distance in years has nothing to do with this.  It's about the evaluation of prospects regardless of who was credited with developing said prospects, the point about BA refining their evaluation process since 2001 being a far more cogent point to bring up as a rebuttal than the specious points you bring up.

Be honest - how much of that was from memory?

[World's #1 Astros Fan]

Baseball America's top 100 prospects released last night.  

5. Baez
8. Bryant
28. Edwards
36. Almora
41. Soler
87. Pierce Johnson
100. Alcantara

Hoping history doesn't repeat itself...

2. Corey Patterson
17.  Juan Cruz
22. Hee Seop Choi
37.  Ben Christiansen
68.  Carlos Zambrano
73. Luis Montanez

You people have fucking problems.

Huey was expressing a hope. What's wrong with that?

I realize I'm talking out of both sides of my mouth.  I just couldn't resist trolling Pen's optimism.  I am optimistic about Epstein's regime getting this franchise on the right  track; but at the same time I confess to being a little weary about these fancy statfaggy prospect projections, the flameouts of the 2001 prospects (Zambrano excepted) leaving me a little scarred.  In the end, I'm subverting my skepticism to Theo dongchuggery.

You know that was 13 years ago, right?  
Under a totally different regime?  

Also, 4 of those 6 guys in 2001 played fairly significant roles on a team that was 5 outs from the World Series two years later.

Admittedly, Juan Cruz's significant role was mostly to be shitty.  

Boy that's really a stretch.  

Choi was opening day first baseman but contributed basically nothing to the team's success after getting bonked on the head in the legendary Wood/Clemens interleague game...in June.  He accrued 71 Plate Appearances the rest of the way as his position was manned by Eric Karros and Randall Simon the last 3 months of the season.

Pattersons' season ended in July 6th, and his position was manned by Kenny Lofton.

Cruz made a whopping nine appearances from June 1st through the end of the year after having been banished out of the rotation in favor of pitchers who didn't suck.  He also hurled a whole inning against Atlanta in the postseason.

I think it's fair to say, in fact, that had centerfield been manned by Patterson--who was probably due for a regression similar to the one he did enjoy in September of 2004--and 1st base by Choi, rather than Lofton and Karros/Simon respctively, that the Cubs would not have made the playoffs (let alone come with 5 outs of the pennant)

And the difference in regime and distance in years has nothing to do with this.  It's about the evaluation of prospects regardless of who was credited with developing said prospects, the point about BA refining their evaluation process since 2001 being a far more cogent point to bring up as a rebuttal than the specious points you bring up.

Be honest - how much of that was from memory?

Well I had to look up July 6th for Patterson's last game, the precise number of appearances Cruz made the last half of the season, and Choi's 71 PA's.  Other than that, my memory tells me none of those guys besides Zambrano did a damn thing to put that team within 5 outs of the pennant.

[Yeti]

Well, Choi and Patterson getting injured led to the Cubs using (or acquiring) Karros, Lofton, and Simon. Choi and Patterson accept your apologies

[ChuckD]

Well, Choi and Patterson getting injured led to the Cubs using (or acquiring) Karros, Lofton, Aramis, and Simon. Choi and Patterson accept your apologies

Lest you forget.

[Tonker]

Well, Choi and Patterson getting injured led to the Cubs using (or acquiring) Karros, Lofton, Aramis, and Simon. Choi and Patterson accept your apologies

Lest you forget.

Intrepid Reader Bobby Hill: Hi!

[Chuck to Chuck]

Well, Choi and Patterson getting injured led to the Cubs using (or acquiring) Karros, Lofton, and Simon. Choi and Patterson accept your apologies

And it kept Hendry employed leading to the fun of 2007 and 2008.

Which, outside of Z decking Barrett, really weren't fun at all.

[J. Walter Weatherman]

Well, Choi and Patterson getting injured led to the Cubs using (or acquiring) Karros, Lofton, and Simon. Choi and Patterson accept your apologies

And it kept Hendry employed leading to the fun of 2007 and 2008.

Which, outside of Z decking Barrett, really weren't fun at all.

Certainly not fun like the closing weeks of 2004, right?

[Eli]

Well, Choi and Patterson getting injured led to the Cubs using (or acquiring) Karros, Lofton, and Simon. Choi and Patterson accept your apologies

And it kept Hendry employed leading to the fun of 2007 and 2008.

Which, outside of Z decking Barrett, really weren't fun at all.

I kind of enjoyed watching the Cubs win 97 games in 2008, but I can only speak for myself.

[Chuck to Chuck]

Well, Choi and Patterson getting injured led to the Cubs using (or acquiring) Karros, Lofton, and Simon. Choi and Patterson accept your apologies

And it kept Hendry employed leading to the fun of 2007 and 2008.

Which, outside of Z decking Barrett, really weren't fun at all.

I kind of enjoyed watching the Cubs win 97 games in 2008, but I can only speak for myself.

"Kind of" is right. But shitting the bed in pursuit of a 98th win really left a stank.

[Slaky]

Well, Choi and Patterson getting injured led to the Cubs using (or acquiring) Karros, Lofton, and Simon. Choi and Patterson accept your apologies

And it kept Hendry employed leading to the fun of 2007 and 2008.

Which, outside of Z decking Barrett, really weren't fun at all.

I kind of enjoyed watching the Cubs win 97 games in 2008, but I can only speak for myself.

"Kind of" is right. But shitting the bed in pursuit of a 98th win really left a stank.

I don't even remotely understand what Chuck is getting at.

[SKO]

Well, Choi and Patterson getting injured led to the Cubs using (or acquiring) Karros, Lofton, and Simon. Choi and Patterson accept your apologies

And it kept Hendry employed leading to the fun of 2007 and 2008.

Which, outside of Z decking Barrett, really weren't fun at all.

I kind of enjoyed watching the Cubs win 97 games in 2008, but I can only speak for myself.

"Kind of" is right. But shitting the bed in pursuit of a 98th win really left a stank.

I don't even remotely understand what Chuck is getting at.

Apparently we can't even enjoy playoff seasons if they result in playoff nut punches, so being a Cub fan is officially a 100% joyless death march. Which I'm not surprised is a thing Chuck endorses.

[Tonker]

To be fair to Chuck, that was a particularly joyless postseason, particularly given the fact that the Cubs were officially - by five fucking games - the best team in the NL that year.  They were THIRTEEN games better than the Dodgers, and went down without so much as a whimper, scoring but six fucking runs in the process.  I'm not going to pretend I enjoyed any of that.

[Slaky]

To be fair to Chuck, that was a particularly joyless postseason, particularly given the fact that the Cubs were officially - by five fucking games - the best team in the NL that year.  They were THIRTEEN games better than the Dodgers, and went down without so much as a whimper, scoring but six fucking runs in the process.  I'm not going to pretend I enjoyed any of that.

You enjoyed April through September.

[Tonker]

To be fair to Chuck, that was a particularly joyless postseason, particularly given the fact that the Cubs were officially - by five fucking games - the best team in the NL that year.  They were THIRTEEN games better than the Dodgers, and went down without so much as a whimper, scoring but six fucking runs in the process.  I'm not going to pretend I enjoyed any of that.

You enjoyed April through September.

I certainly did.  It was fucking great.

[Quality Start Machine]

To be fair to Chuck, that was a particularly joyless postseason, particularly given the fact that the Cubs were officially - by five fucking games - the best team in the NL that year.  They were THIRTEEN games better than the Dodgers, and went down without so much as a whimper, scoring but six fucking runs in the process.  I'm not going to pretend I enjoyed any of that.

The Brewers beat out the fucking Mets by a goddamn game. The Cubs would have absolutely curbstomped the fucking Mets.