Javier Baez 2014 ROY-MVP-World Series MVP Thread

[SKO]

Is it sacrilege yet to say he might be better than Ryno?

Might be?  No.

Is?  Definitely.

I was gonna laugh and say "goddammit, Fork" but actually Javy's been about as good through age 23, if not better, than Ryno was. So if 2017 is gonna be Javy's 1984, I'll take it.

I do think he is the most talented Cubs player I've ever seen. Whether he ever lives up to that potential offensively is another question.

[World's #1 Astros Fan]

Is it sacrilege yet to say he might be better than Ryno?

Might be?  No.

Is?  Definitely.

I was gonna laugh and say "goddammit, Fork" but actually Javy's been about as good through age 23, if not better, than Ryno was. So if 2017 is gonna be Javy's 1984, I'll take it.

I do think he is the most talented Cubs player I've ever seen. Whether he ever lives up to that potential offensively is another question.

Ryno at 23 was rather pedestrian. 

It's when he turned 24 that his career took off.

Seems a little soon for the comparison but Baez definitely appears to be in Sandberg's class defensively.

[Canadouche]

Is it sacrilege yet to say he might be better than Ryno?

Might be?  No.

Is?  Definitely.

I was gonna laugh and say "goddammit, Fork" but actually Javy's been about as good through age 23, if not better, than Ryno was. So if 2017 is gonna be Javy's 1984, I'll take it.

I do think he is the most talented Cubs player I've ever seen. Whether he ever lives up to that potential offensively is another question.

Ryno at 23 was rather pedestrian. 

It's when he turned 24 that his career took off.

Seems a little soon for the comparison but Baez definitely appears to be in Sandberg's class defensively.

And the thing that made Sandberg special was, in no small part, consistency and longevity. If Baez could be this good for 10+ solid years... it's hard for me to even imagine what that would be like.

[World's #1 Astros Fan]

Is it sacrilege yet to say he might be better than Ryno?

Might be?  No.

Is?  Definitely.

I was gonna laugh and say "goddammit, Fork" but actually Javy's been about as good through age 23, if not better, than Ryno was. So if 2017 is gonna be Javy's 1984, I'll take it.

I do think he is the most talented Cubs player I've ever seen. Whether he ever lives up to that potential offensively is another question.

Ryno at 23 was rather pedestrian.  

It's when he turned 24 that his career took off.

Seems a little soon for the comparison but Baez definitely appears to be in Sandberg's class defensively.

And the thing that made Sandberg special was, in no small part, consistency and longevity. If Baez could be this good for 10+ solid years... it's hard for me to even imagine what that would be like.

I would say that what made Sandberg special was his uncanny ability to almost always be in position, squared up and not diving like spazz, to make the play.  It's part of the reason he's one of only 2 second baseman in history to collect 6 seasons with at least 500 assists.  He just seemed to correctly anticipate where the ball was going to be.  I'm not sure this sort of thing can be taught, as it seems somewhat instinctive or preternatural--but the good news is Baez also seems to have this talent.  Combined with Baez' quickness of hands--something that does not spring to mind when I think of Sandberg-- I feel he could surpass Ryno, and that'd be amazing.

[Quality Start Machine]

Is it sacrilege yet to say he might be better than Ryno?

Might be?  No.

Is?  Definitely.

I was gonna laugh and say "goddammit, Fork" but actually Javy's been about as good through age 23, if not better, than Ryno was. So if 2017 is gonna be Javy's 1984, I'll take it.

I do think he is the most talented Cubs player I've ever seen. Whether he ever lives up to that potential offensively is another question.

Ryno at 23 was rather pedestrian.  

It's when he turned 24 that his career took off.

Seems a little soon for the comparison but Baez definitely appears to be in Sandberg's class defensively.

And the thing that made Sandberg special was, in no small part, consistency and longevity. If Baez could be this good for 10+ solid years... it's hard for me to even imagine what that would be like.

I would say that what made Sandberg special was his uncanny ability to almost always be in position, squared up and not diving like spazz, to make the play.  It's part of the reason he's one of only 2 second baseman in history to collect 6 seasons with at least 500 assists.  He just seemed to correctly anticipate where the ball was going to be.  I'm not sure this sort of thing can be taught, as it seems somewhat instinctive or preternatural--but the good news is Baez also seems to have this talent.  Combined with Baez' quickness of hands--something that does not spring to mind when I think of Sandberg-- I feel he could surpass Ryno, and that'd be amazing.

Baez doesn't have Ryno's positioning, but goddamn he covers a lot of ground.

[Oleg]

Is it sacrilege yet to say he might be better than Ryno?

Might be?  No.

Is?  Definitely.

I was gonna laugh and say "goddammit, Fork" but actually Javy's been about as good through age 23, if not better, than Ryno was. So if 2017 is gonna be Javy's 1984, I'll take it.

I do think he is the most talented Cubs player I've ever seen. Whether he ever lives up to that potential offensively is another question.

Ryno at 23 was rather pedestrian.  

It's when he turned 24 that his career took off.

Seems a little soon for the comparison but Baez definitely appears to be in Sandberg's class defensively.

And the thing that made Sandberg special was, in no small part, consistency and longevity. If Baez could be this good for 10+ solid years... it's hard for me to even imagine what that would be like.

I would say that what made Sandberg special was his uncanny ability to almost always be in position, squared up and not diving like spazz, to make the play.  It's part of the reason he's one of only 2 second baseman in history to collect 6 seasons with at least 500 assists.  He just seemed to correctly anticipate where the ball was going to be.  I'm not sure this sort of thing can be taught, as it seems somewhat instinctive or preternatural--but the good news is Baez also seems to have this talent.  Combined with Baez' quickness of hands--something that does not spring to mind when I think of Sandberg-- I feel he could surpass Ryno, and that'd be amazing.

Baez doesn't have Ryno's positioning, but goddamn he covers a lot of ground.

I kind of find it strange to attribute positioning to some skill a player would have.  Now, granted, The Cubs have shifted (in an extreme way) less often than others but defensive positioning as a whole seems to have taken a whole new life over the past 5 years, much less over the past 30, because the coaches simply have more data to use than ever.

Sandberg was a great defensive player but how would he compare to others in today's game?  Do shifts (or, more to the point, better positioning management due to an abundance and use of data) make it easier for good defensive players to be great?  Would Sandberg be even better today?

[SKO]

Is it sacrilege yet to say he might be better than Ryno?

Might be?  No.

Is?  Definitely.

I was gonna laugh and say "goddammit, Fork" but actually Javy's been about as good through age 23, if not better, than Ryno was. So if 2017 is gonna be Javy's 1984, I'll take it.

I do think he is the most talented Cubs player I've ever seen. Whether he ever lives up to that potential offensively is another question.

Ryno at 23 was rather pedestrian.  

It's when he turned 24 that his career took off.

Seems a little soon for the comparison but Baez definitely appears to be in Sandberg's class defensively.

And the thing that made Sandberg special was, in no small part, consistency and longevity. If Baez could be this good for 10+ solid years... it's hard for me to even imagine what that would be like.

I would say that what made Sandberg special was his uncanny ability to almost always be in position, squared up and not diving like spazz, to make the play.  It's part of the reason he's one of only 2 second baseman in history to collect 6 seasons with at least 500 assists.  He just seemed to correctly anticipate where the ball was going to be.  I'm not sure this sort of thing can be taught, as it seems somewhat instinctive or preternatural--but the good news is Baez also seems to have this talent.  Combined with Baez' quickness of hands--something that does not spring to mind when I think of Sandberg-- I feel he could surpass Ryno, and that'd be amazing.

Baez doesn't have Ryno's positioning, but goddamn he covers a lot of ground.

I kind of find it strange to attribute positioning to some skill a player would have.  Now, granted, The Cubs have shifted (in an extreme way) less often than others but defensive positioning as a whole seems to have taken a whole new life over the past 5 years, much less over the past 30, because the coaches simply have more data to use than ever.

Sandberg was a great defensive player but how would he compare to others in today's game?  Do shifts (or, more to the point, better positioning management due to an abundance and use of data) make it easier for good defensive players to be great?  Would Sandberg be even better today?

Or was Ryno just good at self-scouting the opposition and getting into position and in a world where everyone now does that would he look less impressive?

[Quality Start Machine]

Is it sacrilege yet to say he might be better than Ryno?

Might be?  No.

Is?  Definitely.

I was gonna laugh and say "goddammit, Fork" but actually Javy's been about as good through age 23, if not better, than Ryno was. So if 2017 is gonna be Javy's 1984, I'll take it.

I do think he is the most talented Cubs player I've ever seen. Whether he ever lives up to that potential offensively is another question.

Ryno at 23 was rather pedestrian.  

It's when he turned 24 that his career took off.

Seems a little soon for the comparison but Baez definitely appears to be in Sandberg's class defensively.

And the thing that made Sandberg special was, in no small part, consistency and longevity. If Baez could be this good for 10+ solid years... it's hard for me to even imagine what that would be like.

I would say that what made Sandberg special was his uncanny ability to almost always be in position, squared up and not diving like spazz, to make the play.  It's part of the reason he's one of only 2 second baseman in history to collect 6 seasons with at least 500 assists.  He just seemed to correctly anticipate where the ball was going to be.  I'm not sure this sort of thing can be taught, as it seems somewhat instinctive or preternatural--but the good news is Baez also seems to have this talent.  Combined with Baez' quickness of hands--something that does not spring to mind when I think of Sandberg-- I feel he could surpass Ryno, and that'd be amazing.

Baez doesn't have Ryno's positioning, but goddamn he covers a lot of ground.

I kind of find it strange to attribute positioning to some skill a player would have.  Now, granted, The Cubs have shifted (in an extreme way) less often than others but defensive positioning as a whole seems to have taken a whole new life over the past 5 years, much less over the past 30, because the coaches simply have more data to use than ever.

Sandberg was a great defensive player but how would he compare to others in today's game?  Do shifts (or, more to the point, better positioning management due to an abundance and use of data) make it easier for good defensive players to be great?  Would Sandberg be even better today?

Or was Ryno just good at self-scouting the opposition and getting into position and in a world where everyone now does that would he look less impressive?

On the other hand, do the Cubs shift less due to the athleticism of their infielders?

[SKO]

Is it sacrilege yet to say he might be better than Ryno?

Might be?  No.

Is?  Definitely.

I was gonna laugh and say "goddammit, Fork" but actually Javy's been about as good through age 23, if not better, than Ryno was. So if 2017 is gonna be Javy's 1984, I'll take it.

I do think he is the most talented Cubs player I've ever seen. Whether he ever lives up to that potential offensively is another question.

Ryno at 23 was rather pedestrian.  

It's when he turned 24 that his career took off.

Seems a little soon for the comparison but Baez definitely appears to be in Sandberg's class defensively.

And the thing that made Sandberg special was, in no small part, consistency and longevity. If Baez could be this good for 10+ solid years... it's hard for me to even imagine what that would be like.

I would say that what made Sandberg special was his uncanny ability to almost always be in position, squared up and not diving like spazz, to make the play.  It's part of the reason he's one of only 2 second baseman in history to collect 6 seasons with at least 500 assists.  He just seemed to correctly anticipate where the ball was going to be.  I'm not sure this sort of thing can be taught, as it seems somewhat instinctive or preternatural--but the good news is Baez also seems to have this talent.  Combined with Baez' quickness of hands--something that does not spring to mind when I think of Sandberg-- I feel he could surpass Ryno, and that'd be amazing.

Baez doesn't have Ryno's positioning, but goddamn he covers a lot of ground.

I kind of find it strange to attribute positioning to some skill a player would have.  Now, granted, The Cubs have shifted (in an extreme way) less often than others but defensive positioning as a whole seems to have taken a whole new life over the past 5 years, much less over the past 30, because the coaches simply have more data to use than ever.

Sandberg was a great defensive player but how would he compare to others in today's game?  Do shifts (or, more to the point, better positioning management due to an abundance and use of data) make it easier for good defensive players to be great?  Would Sandberg be even better today?

Or was Ryno just good at self-scouting the opposition and getting into position and in a world where everyone now does that would he look less impressive?

On the other hand, do the Cubs shift less due to the athleticism of their infielders?

Sahadev has talked about this and how the whole "the Cubs actually don't shift that much" is kind of inaccurate. Their positioning is just more subtle than most, but they do alter their positioning on almost every play. A lot of teams tend to overshift, when really moving a second baseman a few feet either way will often do the job. Given their historically great job at suppressing BABIP this year and the fact that they may be the best defense in MLB history I think they're probably just ahead of the curve on this stuff.

[Shooter]

Or was Ryno just good at self-scouting the opposition and getting into position and in a world where everyone now does that would he look less impressive?

I think the bigger question is which Hispanic player Cindy would have preferred.

[Canadouche]

I think Javy has become my favourite player.

[Slaky]

I think Javy has become my favourite player.

You and millions of others.

[World's #1 Astros Fan]

Or was Ryno just good at self-scouting the opposition and getting into position and in a world where everyone now does that would he look less impressive?

I think the bigger question is which Hispanic player Cindy would have preferred.

Intrepid Reader:  Cindy Sandberg

You mean I have to choose?

[SKO]

You know that game was nuts because no one even remembered to post about Javy STEALING HOME

[Quality Start Machine]

You know that game was nuts because no one even remembered to post about Javy STEALING HOME

We were too busy goofing on your Twitter feed.