2014 Chicago Cubs: Let's Go 2015 Cubs!

[Quality Start Machine]

I'm going to pour us all a tall, cold glass of settle the fuck down juice by posting the slash lines for this year's epic minor league stud, Gregory Polanco of Pissburgh.

210 PA: .222/.322/.355

That's not alarming because he's shown plenty of speed and power while getting completely owned by LHP.

My point is that while Polanco is probably a big league superstar in the making, the Pirates were crucified for leaving him on the farm while they struggled out of the gate amidst high expectations to compete this year. And even though he absolutely obliterated AAA pitching (.347/.405/.540) and had every Pirate fan with an internet connection going apeshit for two months, he has not represented the savior they thought he'd be in YEAR ONE. So next year, when all our young heroes are at the big league level, and some of them mash and some of them don't, the mouthbreathers will bleat as loud as they ever did. And the Cubs record may not look much better than it did when they sold off everybody the last two years.

So let's see next year for what it actually is: the last year of pretend baseball before the actual thing happens inside Ernest's rectum.

I don't think anybody expects all three to step into the bigs and dominate. The intial stumbling period like Polanco is having is fairly common, following that first burst when no pitcher in the league has a book on him (like Alcantara). Then they adjust, like Baez has in AAA this season. But by late next season at least one of these will be as much fun to watch as Rizzo was in his first year. And in a couple years, we're going to have, like, four fucking Rizzos. We're due.

[InternetApex]

I'm going to pour us all a tall, cold glass of settle the fuck down juice by posting the slash lines for this year's epic minor league stud, Gregory Polanco of Pissburgh.

210 PA: .222/.322/.355

That's not alarming because he's shown plenty of speed and power while getting completely owned by LHP.

My point is that while Polanco is probably a big league superstar in the making, the Pirates were crucified for leaving him on the farm while they struggled out of the gate amidst high expectations to compete this year. And even though he absolutely obliterated AAA pitching (.347/.405/.540) and had every Pirate fan with an internet connection going apeshit for two months, he has not represented the savior they thought he'd be in YEAR ONE. So next year, when all our young heroes are at the big league level, and some of them mash and some of them don't, the mouthbreathers will bleat as loud as they ever did. And the Cubs record may not look much better than it did when they sold off everybody the last two years.

So let's see next year for what it actually is: the last year of pretend baseball before the actual thing happens inside Ernest's rectum.

I don't think anybody expects all three to step into the bigs and dominate. The intial stumbling period like Polanco is having is fairly common, following that first burst when no pitcher in the league has a book on him (like Alcantara). Then they adjust, like Baez has in AAA this season. But by late next season at least one of these will be as much fun to watch as Rizzo was in his first year. And in a couple years, we're going to have, like, four fucking Rizzos. We're due.

Yep.

The 2015 Chicago Cubs: The Welcome Return of Painful Baseball
The 2016 Chicago Cubs: The Welcome Return of Competitive Baseball
The 2017 Chicago Cubs: Four Rizzos, Three Castros and Go Fuck Yourself.

[Slaky]

I'm going to pour us all a tall, cold glass of settle the fuck down juice by posting the slash lines for this year's epic minor league stud, Gregory Polanco of Pissburgh.

210 PA: .222/.322/.355

That's not alarming because he's shown plenty of speed and power while getting completely owned by LHP.

My point is that while Polanco is probably a big league superstar in the making, the Pirates were crucified for leaving him on the farm while they struggled out of the gate amidst high expectations to compete this year. And even though he absolutely obliterated AAA pitching (.347/.405/.540) and had every Pirate fan with an internet connection going apeshit for two months, he has not represented the savior they thought he'd be in YEAR ONE. So next year, when all our young heroes are at the big league level, and some of them mash and some of them don't, the mouthbreathers will bleat as loud as they ever did. And the Cubs record may not look much better than it did when they sold off everybody the last two years.

So let's see next year for what it actually is: the last year of pretend baseball before the actual thing happens inside Ernest's rectum.

Yeah but Puig and Abreu and Cespedes all kicked ass as rookies and they share Cuban lineage with Soler so he's clearly going to kick ass. Bryant is kinda like Evan Longoria in that they play 3B and I want them to be alike and Longoria went to the World Series as a rookie.

So shut up.

Joyful positive is great. My cup runneth over. But Slaky just announced the imminent return of "Painful Baseball" and I think that's the perfect description of what 2015 is going to be. If you thought the haters were out for Theo thus far, wait until they're seven games under .500 on June 1 next year. Oh. My. Gord.

Exactly. Now that the Cubs are "trying" people will be so fucking pissed when they're not in first by 10 games on July 1st. Can't wait.

[CBStew]

I'm going to pour us all a tall, cold glass of settle the fuck down juice by posting the slash lines for this year's epic minor league stud, Gregory Polanco of Pissburgh.

210 PA: .222/.322/.355

That's not alarming because he's shown plenty of speed and power while getting completely owned by LHP.

My point is that while Polanco is probably a big league superstar in the making, the Pirates were crucified for leaving him on the farm while they struggled out of the gate amidst high expectations to compete this year. And even though he absolutely obliterated AAA pitching (.347/.405/.540) and had every Pirate fan with an internet connection going apeshit for two months, he has not represented the savior they thought he'd be in YEAR ONE. So next year, when all our young heroes are at the big league level, and some of them mash and some of them don't, the mouthbreathers will bleat as loud as they ever did. And the Cubs record may not look much better than it did when they sold off everybody the last two years.

So let's see next year for what it actually is: the last year of pretend baseball before the actual thing happens inside Ernest's rectum.

Yeah but Puig and Abreu and Cespedes all kicked ass as rookies and they share Cuban lineage with Soler so he's clearly going to kick ass. Bryant is kinda like Evan Longoria in that they play 3B and I want them to be alike and Longoria went to the World Series as a rookie.

So shut up.

Joyful positive is great. My cup runneth over. But Slaky just announced the imminent return of "Painful Baseball" and I think that's the perfect description of what 2015 is going to be. If you thought the haters were out for Theo thus far, wait until they're seven games under .500 on June 1 next year. Oh. My. Gord.

Exactly. Now that the Cubs are "trying" people will be so fucking pissed when they're not in first by 10 games on July 1st. Can't wait.

I'm pissed that they aren't ten games ahead today!

[Oleg]

Starting to get the feeling this is the last Cubs season for a while where the win/loss at the end of each game means almost nothing. Yes, I realize losing is important for draft pick purposes and I'm sure they'll end up near the top of the draft again. Seems unavoidable. Not something I have to worry about as a fan.

If Soler and Baez are permanent fixtures next season and at least one top of the line starting pitcher comes in via FA, you can't tell me that even with people all saying "next year they'll be better but in 2016 they're going to be really good" are going to be able to help themselves. I think with those additions and the looming spectre of Kris Bryant's arrival fans are going to ready to go from day one. If the Cubs get off to a bad start people will be climbing over themselves to scream Fire Renteria because let's face it - Renteria managing games that matter is a terrifying proposition based on what we've seen.

So let's enjoy this stress free remainder of the season because I'm fairly certain this is it.

Welcome back, painful baseball.

Oh no doubt. And I don't think Bryant waits that long. I doubt they'll worry about Super 2 so I think he just needs to wait till May at the latest to get the extra year. So if you've got Baez, Soler, Bryant, and Mendy with Russell definitely lurking for a midseason callup, and some extra help in the rotation, you'd definitely think that team can win 78-85 games potentially, and with the Selig Card that'll be enough to keep them close enough to contending that we'll all be suckered in.

Would this be the right place for me to make my wild assed prediction that Baez, Bryant and Soler all get called up Sept. 1st? And that Theo lets it be known that they don't give a shit about Super 2 or arbitration status for those guys because they've got a ton of payroll flexibility and they're going to start using it? And that they intend for all 3 of them to be on the big league team to start next season?

Even if that wouldn't be the optimal decision in terms of asset management I think it would send a nice message to potential FAs (hi Jon Lester!) that they're done fucking around.

If they didn't give a shit about Super 2 or arbitration, wouldn't they have already called up Baez instead of Valaika?

The Super 2 is not the issue, Dude.

If they did really, really care about Super 2 arbitration more than anything, these guys wouldn't be arriving until mid-summer next year, which I feel everyone here agrees is unlikely. And, whether they're called up now or they're held back until May or so 2015, either way they'll be expected to hit arbitration after 2017.

If Super 2 is off the table, the only contract/money concern is total years of team control (including arbitration years).

Chuck believes that matters for Bryant (because Boras), so that's why he's suggesting we won't get Chicago Bryant boners until May or thereabouts, as that will give the Cubs team control through the end of 2021, with arbitration after 2017, rather than 2020 (and still arbitration after 2017) if he came up now.

Here's the thing about Super 2...isn't it based on when everyone is called up and not on some arbitrary date?  I other words, if every team is scared of Super 2 and no one starts their top prospects in the majors out of Spring Training, does it matter when The Cubs call up Bryant, etc?

[Chuck to Chuck]

Starting to get the feeling this is the last Cubs season for a while where the win/loss at the end of each game means almost nothing. Yes, I realize losing is important for draft pick purposes and I'm sure they'll end up near the top of the draft again. Seems unavoidable. Not something I have to worry about as a fan.

If Soler and Baez are permanent fixtures next season and at least one top of the line starting pitcher comes in via FA, you can't tell me that even with people all saying "next year they'll be better but in 2016 they're going to be really good" are going to be able to help themselves. I think with those additions and the looming spectre of Kris Bryant's arrival fans are going to ready to go from day one. If the Cubs get off to a bad start people will be climbing over themselves to scream Fire Renteria because let's face it - Renteria managing games that matter is a terrifying proposition based on what we've seen.

So let's enjoy this stress free remainder of the season because I'm fairly certain this is it.

Welcome back, painful baseball.

Oh no doubt. And I don't think Bryant waits that long. I doubt they'll worry about Super 2 so I think he just needs to wait till May at the latest to get the extra year. So if you've got Baez, Soler, Bryant, and Mendy with Russell definitely lurking for a midseason callup, and some extra help in the rotation, you'd definitely think that team can win 78-85 games potentially, and with the Selig Card that'll be enough to keep them close enough to contending that we'll all be suckered in.

Would this be the right place for me to make my wild assed prediction that Baez, Bryant and Soler all get called up Sept. 1st? And that Theo lets it be known that they don't give a shit about Super 2 or arbitration status for those guys because they've got a ton of payroll flexibility and they're going to start using it? And that they intend for all 3 of them to be on the big league team to start next season?

Even if that wouldn't be the optimal decision in terms of asset management I think it would send a nice message to potential FAs (hi Jon Lester!) that they're done fucking around.

If they didn't give a shit about Super 2 or arbitration, wouldn't they have already called up Baez instead of Valaika?

The Super 2 is not the issue, Dude.

If they did really, really care about Super 2 arbitration more than anything, these guys wouldn't be arriving until mid-summer next year, which I feel everyone here agrees is unlikely. And, whether they're called up now or they're held back until May or so 2015, either way they'll be expected to hit arbitration after 2017.

If Super 2 is off the table, the only contract/money concern is total years of team control (including arbitration years).

Chuck believes that matters for Bryant (because Boras), so that's why he's suggesting we won't get Chicago Bryant boners until May or thereabouts, as that will give the Cubs team control through the end of 2021, with arbitration after 2017, rather than 2020 (and still arbitration after 2017) if he came up now.

Correct. I think Bryant arrives post-service time but pre-Super 2 time in 2015.

I will caveat that there is a way for Bryant to come up in September 2014, and that is if he starts at Iowa in 2015 and stays until June (to make sure his 6-year free agency clock doesn't expire until sometime in year 7.  I don't think they'll do that because they won't want to/be able to send him down once he's up.

[InternetApex]

Starting to get the feeling this is the last Cubs season for a while where the win/loss at the end of each game means almost nothing. Yes, I realize losing is important for draft pick purposes and I'm sure they'll end up near the top of the draft again. Seems unavoidable. Not something I have to worry about as a fan.

If Soler and Baez are permanent fixtures next season and at least one top of the line starting pitcher comes in via FA, you can't tell me that even with people all saying "next year they'll be better but in 2016 they're going to be really good" are going to be able to help themselves. I think with those additions and the looming spectre of Kris Bryant's arrival fans are going to ready to go from day one. If the Cubs get off to a bad start people will be climbing over themselves to scream Fire Renteria because let's face it - Renteria managing games that matter is a terrifying proposition based on what we've seen.

So let's enjoy this stress free remainder of the season because I'm fairly certain this is it.

Welcome back, painful baseball.

Oh no doubt. And I don't think Bryant waits that long. I doubt they'll worry about Super 2 so I think he just needs to wait till May at the latest to get the extra year. So if you've got Baez, Soler, Bryant, and Mendy with Russell definitely lurking for a midseason callup, and some extra help in the rotation, you'd definitely think that team can win 78-85 games potentially, and with the Selig Card that'll be enough to keep them close enough to contending that we'll all be suckered in.

Would this be the right place for me to make my wild assed prediction that Baez, Bryant and Soler all get called up Sept. 1st? And that Theo lets it be known that they don't give a shit about Super 2 or arbitration status for those guys because they've got a ton of payroll flexibility and they're going to start using it? And that they intend for all 3 of them to be on the big league team to start next season?

Even if that wouldn't be the optimal decision in terms of asset management I think it would send a nice message to potential FAs (hi Jon Lester!) that they're done fucking around.

If they didn't give a shit about Super 2 or arbitration, wouldn't they have already called up Baez instead of Valaika?

The Super 2 is not the issue, Dude.

If they did really, really care about Super 2 arbitration more than anything, these guys wouldn't be arriving until mid-summer next year, which I feel everyone here agrees is unlikely. And, whether they're called up now or they're held back until May or so 2015, either way they'll be expected to hit arbitration after 2017.

If Super 2 is off the table, the only contract/money concern is total years of team control (including arbitration years).

Chuck believes that matters for Bryant (because Boras), so that's why he's suggesting we won't get Chicago Bryant boners until May or thereabouts, as that will give the Cubs team control through the end of 2021, with arbitration after 2017, rather than 2020 (and still arbitration after 2017) if he came up now.

Correct. I think Bryant arrives post-service time but pre-Super 2 time in 2015.

I will caveat that there is a way for Bryant to come up in September 2014, and that is if he starts at Iowa in 2015 and stays until June (to make sure his 6-year free agency clock doesn't expire until sometime in year 7.  I don't think they'll do that because they won't want to/be able to send him down once he's up.

So if he starts and stays in Iowa in 2015 they'll retroactively call him up and replay all the games from September 2014? That sounds exhausting. I wonder what other teams would field a September 2014 team for 2015 to play in the September Chuck League. Could we get Zambrano back for that? Why not? Maybe Sandberg will be available to manage.

[Quality Start Machine]

Why would the Cubs bring up a player for a month, only to let him spend time next year bending AAA pitching over the sink?

Once he's here, he's here. Unless he starts putting up Oltian numbers.

[J. Walter Weatherman]

Starting to get the feeling this is the last Cubs season for a while where the win/loss at the end of each game means almost nothing. Yes, I realize losing is important for draft pick purposes and I'm sure they'll end up near the top of the draft again. Seems unavoidable. Not something I have to worry about as a fan.

If Soler and Baez are permanent fixtures next season and at least one top of the line starting pitcher comes in via FA, you can't tell me that even with people all saying "next year they'll be better but in 2016 they're going to be really good" are going to be able to help themselves. I think with those additions and the looming spectre of Kris Bryant's arrival fans are going to ready to go from day one. If the Cubs get off to a bad start people will be climbing over themselves to scream Fire Renteria because let's face it - Renteria managing games that matter is a terrifying proposition based on what we've seen.

So let's enjoy this stress free remainder of the season because I'm fairly certain this is it.

Welcome back, painful baseball.

Oh no doubt. And I don't think Bryant waits that long. I doubt they'll worry about Super 2 so I think he just needs to wait till May at the latest to get the extra year. So if you've got Baez, Soler, Bryant, and Mendy with Russell definitely lurking for a midseason callup, and some extra help in the rotation, you'd definitely think that team can win 78-85 games potentially, and with the Selig Card that'll be enough to keep them close enough to contending that we'll all be suckered in.

Would this be the right place for me to make my wild assed prediction that Baez, Bryant and Soler all get called up Sept. 1st? And that Theo lets it be known that they don't give a shit about Super 2 or arbitration status for those guys because they've got a ton of payroll flexibility and they're going to start using it? And that they intend for all 3 of them to be on the big league team to start next season?

Even if that wouldn't be the optimal decision in terms of asset management I think it would send a nice message to potential FAs (hi Jon Lester!) that they're done fucking around.

If they didn't give a shit about Super 2 or arbitration, wouldn't they have already called up Baez instead of Valaika?

The Super 2 is not the issue, Dude.

If they did really, really care about Super 2 arbitration more than anything, these guys wouldn't be arriving until mid-summer next year, which I feel everyone here agrees is unlikely. And, whether they're called up now or they're held back until May or so 2015, either way they'll be expected to hit arbitration after 2017.

If Super 2 is off the table, the only contract/money concern is total years of team control (including arbitration years).

Chuck believes that matters for Bryant (because Boras), so that's why he's suggesting we won't get Chicago Bryant boners until May or thereabouts, as that will give the Cubs team control through the end of 2021, with arbitration after 2017, rather than 2020 (and still arbitration after 2017) if he came up now.

Correct. I think Bryant arrives post-service time but pre-Super 2 time in 2015.

I will caveat that there is a way for Bryant to come up in September 2014, and that is if he starts at Iowa in 2015 and stays until June (to make sure his 6-year free agency clock doesn't expire until sometime in year 7.  I don't think they'll do that because they won't want to/be able to send him down once he's up.

So if he starts and stays in Iowa in 2015 they'll retroactively call him up and replay all the games from September 2014? That sounds exhausting. I wonder what other teams would field a September 2014 team for 2015 to play in the September Chuck League. Could we get Zambrano back for that? Why not? Maybe Sandberg will be available to manage.

I think the point is that service time is cumulative but need not be consecutive.

So Bryant could come up this year without necessarily burning off that 'extra year' Chuck wants. But, in order to do so, he'd have to spend more time in the minors next season to avoid reaching a full year of service time (172 days) before the end of the 2015 season.

[Chuck to Chuck]

Starting to get the feeling this is the last Cubs season for a while where the win/loss at the end of each game means almost nothing. Yes, I realize losing is important for draft pick purposes and I'm sure they'll end up near the top of the draft again. Seems unavoidable. Not something I have to worry about as a fan.

If Soler and Baez are permanent fixtures next season and at least one top of the line starting pitcher comes in via FA, you can't tell me that even with people all saying "next year they'll be better but in 2016 they're going to be really good" are going to be able to help themselves. I think with those additions and the looming spectre of Kris Bryant's arrival fans are going to ready to go from day one. If the Cubs get off to a bad start people will be climbing over themselves to scream Fire Renteria because let's face it - Renteria managing games that matter is a terrifying proposition based on what we've seen.

So let's enjoy this stress free remainder of the season because I'm fairly certain this is it.

Welcome back, painful baseball.

Oh no doubt. And I don't think Bryant waits that long. I doubt they'll worry about Super 2 so I think he just needs to wait till May at the latest to get the extra year. So if you've got Baez, Soler, Bryant, and Mendy with Russell definitely lurking for a midseason callup, and some extra help in the rotation, you'd definitely think that team can win 78-85 games potentially, and with the Selig Card that'll be enough to keep them close enough to contending that we'll all be suckered in.

Would this be the right place for me to make my wild assed prediction that Baez, Bryant and Soler all get called up Sept. 1st? And that Theo lets it be known that they don't give a shit about Super 2 or arbitration status for those guys because they've got a ton of payroll flexibility and they're going to start using it? And that they intend for all 3 of them to be on the big league team to start next season?

Even if that wouldn't be the optimal decision in terms of asset management I think it would send a nice message to potential FAs (hi Jon Lester!) that they're done fucking around.

If they didn't give a shit about Super 2 or arbitration, wouldn't they have already called up Baez instead of Valaika?

The Super 2 is not the issue, Dude.

If they did really, really care about Super 2 arbitration more than anything, these guys wouldn't be arriving until mid-summer next year, which I feel everyone here agrees is unlikely. And, whether they're called up now or they're held back until May or so 2015, either way they'll be expected to hit arbitration after 2017.

If Super 2 is off the table, the only contract/money concern is total years of team control (including arbitration years).

Chuck believes that matters for Bryant (because Boras), so that's why he's suggesting we won't get Chicago Bryant boners until May or thereabouts, as that will give the Cubs team control through the end of 2021, with arbitration after 2017, rather than 2020 (and still arbitration after 2017) if he came up now.

Correct. I think Bryant arrives post-service time but pre-Super 2 time in 2015.

I will caveat that there is a way for Bryant to come up in September 2014, and that is if he starts at Iowa in 2015 and stays until June (to make sure his 6-year free agency clock doesn't expire until sometime in year 7.  I don't think they'll do that because they won't want to/be able to send him down once he's up.

So if he starts and stays in Iowa in 2015 they'll retroactively call him up and replay all the games from September 2014? That sounds exhausting. I wonder what other teams would field a September 2014 team for 2015 to play in the September Chuck League. Could we get Zambrano back for that? Why not? Maybe Sandberg will be available to manage.

I think the point is that service time is cumulative but need not be consecutive.

So Bryant could come up this year without necessarily burning off that 'extra year' Chuck wants. But, in order to do so, he'd have to spend more time in the minors next season to avoid reaching a full year of service time (172 days) before the end of the 2015 season.

Yep.

[CBStew]

Given my seniority I am the last person who should be saying this, but what is the hurry?  The Cubs are 16 games under .500.  Having Bryant up at any time during this season isn't going to change the outcome of the season, unless you think that making a madcap run at fourth place is a worthy project.

[J. Walter Weatherman]

Given my seniority I am the last person who should be saying this, but what is the hurry?  The Cubs are 16 games under .500.  Having Bryant up at any time during this season isn't going to change the outcome of the season, unless you think that making a madcap run at fourth place is a worthy project.

The only real question is whether calling him up now would be better for his development as a player.

[SKO]

Given my seniority I am the last person who should be saying this, but what is the hurry?  The Cubs are 16 games under .500.  Having Bryant up at any time during this season isn't going to change the outcome of the season, unless you think that making a madcap run at fourth place is a worthy project.

The point would be to have Baez and Bryant get all of their adjustments out of the way now in meaningless games so as to have them ready for a season where they're actually trying to win next year.

[Quality Start Machine]

Given my seniority I am the last person who should be saying this, but what is the hurry?  The Cubs are 16 games under .500.  Having Bryant up at any time during this season isn't going to change the outcome of the season, unless you think that making a madcap run at fourth place is a worthy project.

The point would be to have Baez and Bryant get all of their adjustments out of the way now in meaningless games so as to have them ready for a season where they're actually trying to win next year.

Baez had a much longer adjustment to AAA than Bryant did. He's just getting a head start.

[Saul Goodman]

Claimed Cole Hamels. Can they get a deal done without trading core guys? Maybe Almora?