Firebarn David Ross

[SKO]

A catcher who can't hit squatting behind the dish when your ace pitching isn't exactly a new thing, guys. Why get worked up over it now?

Because why have TWO of those guys? They traded for Montero and accepted his massive contract because he is a top notch defensive catcher. There's no reason Jon Lester needs a personal catcher wasting a spot they very obviously need for another bench player when they already have Montero on the roster.

Like I said, this isn't Maddux not wanting to throw to Michael Barrett, a moron and shitty defensive catcher. This is choosing a catcher who isn't even as good behind the plate as your regular starter, and who takes up a spot that could go to someone who could actually pinch it.

Isn't this, basically, what Castillo is right now?  With all the positional flexibility on the rest of the roster, Castillo is a guy who can pinch hit.  Woo hoo!  I don't understand what roster spot Ross is wasting.  They need a backup catcher no matter what, right?  If that backup catcher is Castillo, they'd need another "someone who could actually pinch hit".  I don't understand...

Well golly why have two guys capable of pinch hitting when you have one!

How often will your backup catcher pinch hit in a close game?  I'm thinking most of the time he's held back in case something happens to the starter, right?  For fuck's sake, he's a goddamn backup catcher!

I'm all for firebarning those who deserve it (fuck you, Blake Dewitt).  But, jebus...let's everyone just calm down!!!!!

Adding kindling.

Well why did they sign 2015 David Ross if 2011 David Ross was available?

No shit. Let's go out and sign 2011 Lance Berkman and his .959 OPS to come off the bench and pinch-hit. He's available, after all.

I'm still getting over the logic of "why not turn the positive of a backup catcher who can hit into a negative by adding a second no-hit backup catcher at the expense of a position player who might be able to hit?"

Oleg does have a valid point about backup catchers generally not being used as pinch-hitters. If Montero & Castillo are the only catchers on the roster, Beef probably does not pinch-hit in these last 3 games. Then again, Maddon likes to take nice soft poops on conventional baseball wisdom, so who knows.

True, but they're in a situation right now where Travis Wood has had to pinch hit because their bench is so short. When a roster spot they actually need is taken up by a guy they don't need, I get angry at that guy. I never said it was fair or rational but Ross sucks so I feel pretty safe up here, steering this hatewagon.

I hated Koyie Hill, too. It's good times when the guy that's most hateable on the roster is the backup catcher, because that means you have depth elsewhere, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't hate people. Hate's what makes life worth livin, folks.


I mean, just for a hypothetical let's say the Cubs have the best player at every single position. Stanton, Cabrera, Trout, etc. they're all Cubs. The team wins 118 games, but for some reason 200 at bats that year go to Aaron Miles. There's no real need for Aaron Miles to be on the roster. He's just there because he's bros with Stanton or some shit. So you gotta watch him waddle up there and hit .109 for 190 ABs when you know, by God, you shouldn't have to.

You gonna tell me there's no Firebarn thread on this here blog for him? Eh?

[Oleg]

A catcher who can't hit squatting behind the dish when your ace pitching isn't exactly a new thing, guys. Why get worked up over it now?

Because why have TWO of those guys? They traded for Montero and accepted his massive contract because he is a top notch defensive catcher. There's no reason Jon Lester needs a personal catcher wasting a spot they very obviously need for another bench player when they already have Montero on the roster.

Like I said, this isn't Maddux not wanting to throw to Michael Barrett, a moron and shitty defensive catcher. This is choosing a catcher who isn't even as good behind the plate as your regular starter, and who takes up a spot that could go to someone who could actually pinch it.

Isn't this, basically, what Castillo is right now?  With all the positional flexibility on the rest of the roster, Castillo is a guy who can pinch hit.  Woo hoo!  I don't understand what roster spot Ross is wasting.  They need a backup catcher no matter what, right?  If that backup catcher is Castillo, they'd need another "someone who could actually pinch hit".  I don't understand...

Well golly why have two guys capable of pinch hitting when you have one!

How often will your backup catcher pinch hit in a close game?  I'm thinking most of the time he's held back in case something happens to the starter, right?  For fuck's sake, he's a goddamn backup catcher!

I'm all for firebarning those who deserve it (fuck you, Blake Dewitt).  But, jebus...let's everyone just calm down!!!!!

Adding kindling.

Well why did they sign 2015 David Ross if 2011 David Ross was available?

No shit. Let's go out and sign 2011 Lance Berkman and his .959 OPS to come off the bench and pinch-hit. He's available, after all.

I'm still getting over the logic of "why not turn the positive of a backup catcher who can hit into a negative by adding a second no-hit backup catcher at the expense of a position player who might be able to hit?"

Oleg does have a valid point about backup catchers generally not being used as pinch-hitters. If Montero & Castillo are the only catchers on the roster, Beef probably does not pinch-hit in these last 3 games. Then again, Maddon likes to take nice soft poops on conventional baseball wisdom, so who knows.

True, but they're in a situation right now where Travis Wood has had to pinch hit because their bench is so short. When a roster spot they actually need is taken up by a guy they don't need, I get angry at that guy. I never said it was fair or rational but Ross sucks so I feel pretty safe up here, steering this hatewagon.

I hated Koyie Hill, too. It's good times when the guy that's most hateable on the roster is the backup catcher, because that means you have depth elsewhere, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't hate people. Hate's what makes life worth livin, folks.


I mean, just for a hypothetical let's say the Cubs have the best player at every single position. Stanton, Cabrera, Trout, etc. they're all Cubs. The team wins 118 games, but for some reason 200 at bats that year go to Aaron Miles. There's no real need for Aaron Miles to be on the roster. He's just there because he's bros with Stanton or some shit. So you gotta watch him waddle up there and hit .109 for 190 ABs when you know, by God, you shouldn't have to.

You gonna tell me there's no Firebarn thread on this here blog for him? Eh?

If Aaron Miles could do only thing that a starter on said team could do, then you live with those 190 ABs.  Because if the starter goes down in any game, that one thing that he can do becomes really fucking important.  At the same time, you don't really want to spend too many resources on that thing because, hey, it's only 190 ABs.

It's sort of like having a spare tire that's not really a full size tire.  You don't really want to drive on it too much but if when you need it, it becomes really important.

[SKO]

If Aaron Miles could do only thing that a starter on said team could do, then you live with those 190 ABs.  Because if the starter goes down in any game, that one thing that he can do becomes really fucking important.  At the same time, you don't really want to spend too many resources on that thing because, hey, it's only 190 ABs.

It's sort of like having a spare tire that's not really a full size tire.  You don't really want to drive on it too much but if when you need it, it becomes really important.

So again what does David Ross do that's so important? If Montero goes down you have Wellington, and pitch framing be damned, Castillo would take the majority of the starts at catcher in that scenario. If your argument gets down to "what if Montero and Wellington BOTH get hurt?" that's just stupid. You do what every other team that isn't carrying three catchers does and call up some replacement player or sign a guy off waivers or trade a PTBNL for some scrub. You don't need that scrub on the roster taking up space before that scenario plays out.

Once again, your argument is defeated because the whole reason I can't tolerate David Ross is precisely because there is no need for him, whatsoever. That is if I understood your argument, which made no grammatical sense.

[SKO]

I mean seriously if your only defense of a guy is "oh come on, he barely plays, he's not hurting them that much", I deem that guy firebarnable.

[Oleg]

If Aaron Miles could do only thing that a starter on said team could do, then you live with those 190 ABs.  Because if the starter goes down in any game, that one thing that he can do becomes really fucking important.  At the same time, you don't really want to spend too many resources on that thing because, hey, it's only 190 ABs.

It's sort of like having a spare tire that's not really a full size tire.  You don't really want to drive on it too much but if when you need it, it becomes really important.

So again what does David Ross do that's so important? If Montero goes down you have Wellington, and pitch framing be damned, Castillo would take the majority of the starts at catcher in that scenario. If your argument gets down to "what if Montero and Wellington BOTH get hurt?" that's just stupid. You do what every other team that isn't carrying three catchers does and call up some replacement player or sign a guy off waivers or trade a PTBNL for some scrub. You don't need that scrub on the roster taking up space before that scenario plays out.

Once again, your argument is defeated because the whole reason I can't tolerate David Ross is precisely because there is no need for him, whatsoever. That is if I understood your argument, which made no grammatical sense.

Other than his starts for Lester, David Ross will get about 15 other PAs.  So, go ahead and hate.  I don't give a shit anymore.

The biggest problem right now is that the starting lineup isn't complete and Maddon has to pinch hit for position players late in games.  Once Bryant is up, that gets mitigated a little (hopefully).  If either Alcantra or Baez figure their shit out, there's even fewer opportunities to pinch hit.  If Russell comes up and rakes, even less so.

So, whatever, man.

[SKO]

If Aaron Miles could do only thing that a starter on said team could do, then you live with those 190 ABs.  Because if the starter goes down in any game, that one thing that he can do becomes really fucking important.  At the same time, you don't really want to spend too many resources on that thing because, hey, it's only 190 ABs.

It's sort of like having a spare tire that's not really a full size tire.  You don't really want to drive on it too much but if when you need it, it becomes really important.

So again what does David Ross do that's so important? If Montero goes down you have Wellington, and pitch framing be damned, Castillo would take the majority of the starts at catcher in that scenario. If your argument gets down to "what if Montero and Wellington BOTH get hurt?" that's just stupid. You do what every other team that isn't carrying three catchers does and call up some replacement player or sign a guy off waivers or trade a PTBNL for some scrub. You don't need that scrub on the roster taking up space before that scenario plays out.

Once again, your argument is defeated because the whole reason I can't tolerate David Ross is precisely because there is no need for him, whatsoever. That is if I understood your argument, which made no grammatical sense.

Other than his starts for Lester, David Ross will get about 15 other PAs.  So, go ahead and hate.  I don't give a shit anymore.

The biggest problem right now is that the starters aren't complete and Maddon has to pinch hit for position players late in games.  Once Bryant is up, that gets mitigated a little (hopefully).  If either Alcantra or Baez figure their shit out, there's even fewer opportunities to pinch hit.  If Russel comes up and rakes, even less so.

So, whatever, man.

Well I mean I'm not arguing "David Ross is single-handedly sinking the playoff hopes of the 2015 Cubs". I'm just arguing "David Ross sucks and shouldn't be on the roster until/unless Castillo gets traded."

I have hated for much less.

[Powdered Toast Man]

If Aaron Miles could do only thing that a starter on said team could do, then you live with those 190 ABs.  Because if the starter goes down in any game, that one thing that he can do becomes really fucking important.  At the same time, you don't really want to spend too many resources on that thing because, hey, it's only 190 ABs.

It's sort of like having a spare tire that's not really a full size tire.  You don't really want to drive on it too much but if when you need it, it becomes really important.

So again what does David Ross do that's so important? If Montero goes down you have Wellington, and pitch framing be damned, Castillo would take the majority of the starts at catcher in that scenario. If your argument gets down to "what if Montero and Wellington BOTH get hurt?" that's just stupid. You do what every other team that isn't carrying three catchers does and call up some replacement player or sign a guy off waivers or trade a PTBNL for some scrub. You don't need that scrub on the roster taking up space before that scenario plays out.

Once again, your argument is defeated because the whole reason I can't tolerate David Ross is precisely because there is no need for him, whatsoever. That is if I understood your argument, which made no grammatical sense.

I have to think that David Ross, a 38 year old backup catcher (whom I don't think is Koyie Hill levels of bad backup catching), has to hold some kind of value to organizations (like Boston, Atlanta, Chicago) outside of pure production especially considering his awful stats. Maybe, just maybe, David Ross is the CLUBHOUSE GUY with all the GRIT and whatnot. Maybe with all the VORP and WAR and UZR and BABiP numbers Theo and Jed have crunched to create this roster/farm system, they found one roster spot for this kind of guy...the backup catcher guy who has a gray beard and probably needs a Disney movie made about him that knows how to handle a pitching staff and might transition into the organization after his playing career.

I feel like I'm going to get destroyed for this.

[Oleg]

If Aaron Miles could do only thing that a starter on said team could do, then you live with those 190 ABs.  Because if the starter goes down in any game, that one thing that he can do becomes really fucking important.  At the same time, you don't really want to spend too many resources on that thing because, hey, it's only 190 ABs.

It's sort of like having a spare tire that's not really a full size tire.  You don't really want to drive on it too much but if when you need it, it becomes really important.

So again what does David Ross do that's so important? If Montero goes down you have Wellington, and pitch framing be damned, Castillo would take the majority of the starts at catcher in that scenario. If your argument gets down to "what if Montero and Wellington BOTH get hurt?" that's just stupid. You do what every other team that isn't carrying three catchers does and call up some replacement player or sign a guy off waivers or trade a PTBNL for some scrub. You don't need that scrub on the roster taking up space before that scenario plays out.

Once again, your argument is defeated because the whole reason I can't tolerate David Ross is precisely because there is no need for him, whatsoever. That is if I understood your argument, which made no grammatical sense.

Other than his starts for Lester, David Ross will get about 15 other PAs.  So, go ahead and hate.  I don't give a shit anymore.

The biggest problem right now is that the starters aren't complete and Maddon has to pinch hit for position players late in games.  Once Bryant is up, that gets mitigated a little (hopefully).  If either Alcantra or Baez figure their shit out, there's even fewer opportunities to pinch hit.  If Russel comes up and rakes, even less so.

So, whatever, man.

Well I mean I'm not arguing "David Ross is single-handedly sinking the playoff hopes of the 2015 Cubs". I'm just arguing "David Ross sucks and shouldn't be on the roster until/unless Castillo gets traded."

I have hated for much less.

Shirtless hug.

[World's #1 Astros Fan]

If Aaron Miles could do only thing that a starter on said team could do, then you live with those 190 ABs.  Because if the starter goes down in any game, that one thing that he can do becomes really fucking important.  At the same time, you don't really want to spend too many resources on that thing because, hey, it's only 190 ABs.

It's sort of like having a spare tire that's not really a full size tire.  You don't really want to drive on it too much but if when you need it, it becomes really important.

So again what does David Ross do that's so important? If Montero goes down you have Wellington, and pitch framing be damned, Castillo would take the majority of the starts at catcher in that scenario. If your argument gets down to "what if Montero and Wellington BOTH get hurt?" that's just stupid. You do what every other team that isn't carrying three catchers does and call up some replacement player or sign a guy off waivers or trade a PTBNL for some scrub. You don't need that scrub on the roster taking up space before that scenario plays out.

Once again, your argument is defeated because the whole reason I can't tolerate David Ross is precisely because there is no need for him, whatsoever. That is if I understood your argument, which made no grammatical sense.

I have to think that David Ross, a 38 year old backup catcher (whom I don't think is Koyie Hill levels of bad backup catching), has to hold some kind of value to organizations (like Boston, Atlanta, Chicago) outside of pure production especially considering his awful stats. Maybe, just maybe, David Ross is the CLUBHOUSE GUY with all the GRIT and whatnot. Maybe with all the VORP and WAR and UZR and BABiP numbers Theo and Jed have crunched to create this roster/farm system, they found one roster spot for this kind of guy...the backup catcher guy who has a gray beard and probably needs a Disney movie made about him that knows how to handle a pitching staff and might transition into the organization after his playing career.

I feel like I'm going to get destroyed for this.

Get outta the damn road, you rube.  SKO's driving this Hatemobile with ferocity.

[SKO]

If Aaron Miles could do only thing that a starter on said team could do, then you live with those 190 ABs.  Because if the starter goes down in any game, that one thing that he can do becomes really fucking important.  At the same time, you don't really want to spend too many resources on that thing because, hey, it's only 190 ABs.

It's sort of like having a spare tire that's not really a full size tire.  You don't really want to drive on it too much but if when you need it, it becomes really important.

So again what does David Ross do that's so important? If Montero goes down you have Wellington, and pitch framing be damned, Castillo would take the majority of the starts at catcher in that scenario. If your argument gets down to "what if Montero and Wellington BOTH get hurt?" that's just stupid. You do what every other team that isn't carrying three catchers does and call up some replacement player or sign a guy off waivers or trade a PTBNL for some scrub. You don't need that scrub on the roster taking up space before that scenario plays out.

Once again, your argument is defeated because the whole reason I can't tolerate David Ross is precisely because there is no need for him, whatsoever. That is if I understood your argument, which made no grammatical sense.

I have to think that David Ross, a 38 year old backup catcher (whom I don't think is Koyie Hill levels of bad backup catching), has to hold some kind of value to organizations (like Boston, Atlanta, Chicago) outside of pure production especially considering his awful stats. Maybe, just maybe, David Ross is the CLUBHOUSE GUY with all the GRIT and whatnot. Maybe with all the VORP and WAR and UZR and BABiP numbers Theo and Jed have crunched to create this roster/farm system, they found one roster spot for this kind of guy...the backup catcher guy who has a gray beard and probably needs a Disney movie made about him that knows how to handle a pitching staff and might transition into the organization after his playing career.

I feel like I'm going to get destroyed for this.

Or, OR, they wanted to sign Lester's buddy as a final incentive to get him to come here and now he's under contract so maybe just arrange for Ross to get hit by a bus and have Montero frame Lester's pitches as he goes on an inspiring run to the World Series, pitching his heart out for his beloved friend who was murdered by a Greyhound. That I drove.

[InternetApex]

If Aaron Miles could do only thing that a starter on said team could do, then you live with those 190 ABs.  Because if the starter goes down in any game, that one thing that he can do becomes really fucking important.  At the same time, you don't really want to spend too many resources on that thing because, hey, it's only 190 ABs.

It's sort of like having a spare tire that's not really a full size tire.  You don't really want to drive on it too much but if when you need it, it becomes really important.

So again what does David Ross do that's so important? If Montero goes down you have Wellington, and pitch framing be damned, Castillo would take the majority of the starts at catcher in that scenario. If your argument gets down to "what if Montero and Wellington BOTH get hurt?" that's just stupid. You do what every other team that isn't carrying three catchers does and call up some replacement player or sign a guy off waivers or trade a PTBNL for some scrub. You don't need that scrub on the roster taking up space before that scenario plays out.

Once again, your argument is defeated because the whole reason I can't tolerate David Ross is precisely because there is no need for him, whatsoever. That is if I understood your argument, which made no grammatical sense.

I have to think that David Ross, a 38 year old backup catcher (whom I don't think is Koyie Hill levels of bad backup catching), has to hold some kind of value to organizations (like Boston, Atlanta, Chicago) outside of pure production especially considering his awful stats. Maybe, just maybe, David Ross is the CLUBHOUSE GUY with all the GRIT and whatnot. Maybe with all the VORP and WAR and UZR and BABiP numbers Theo and Jed have crunched to create this roster/farm system, they found one roster spot for this kind of guy...the backup catcher guy who has a gray beard and probably needs a Disney movie made about him that knows how to handle a pitching staff and might transition into the organization after his playing career.

I feel like I'm going to get destroyed for this.

Or, OR, they wanted to sign Lester's buddy as a final incentive to get him to come here and now he's under contract so maybe just arrange for Ross to get hit by a bus and have Montero frame Lester's pitches as he goes on an inspiring run to the World Series, pitching his heart out for his beloved friend who was murdered by a Greyhound. That I drove.

Now that's a Disney movie I'd watch.

[flannj]

4 full pages in under 5 1/2 hours.

[Eli]

4 full pages in under 5 1/2 hours.

That equals the entire board's output from November through January.

[SKO]

Having a no-hit, good defensive catcher in the lineup theoretically makes sense once slapdicks like Herrera and Alcantara* are replaced by guys like Bryant, Russell, and Schwarber. The only problem with that line of thought is (a) it doesn't change that we are currently stuck watching multiple slapdicks (b) any/all of those prospects could die in a dirigible explosion and (c) if they're able to parachute out of the dirigible, it still may take them a couple of years before they consistently hit like non-slapdicks.

* I love Mendy and really hope he pans out, but his half a season of big league hitting thus far definitely falls into the "slapdick" category.

Kinda skipped over this before in my rush to hate David Ross to death, but yeah, I'm pretty concerned about Mendy at this point. It'd be one thing if I could wave off some of his 1-21 start or whatever as bad luck with BABIP or something but it really doesn't seem like he's put a good swing on anything yet, and his approach has been pretty bad.

I hope he turns it around because he'd be a super useful piece if he can just be average offensively.

[Tonker]

A catcher who can't hit squatting behind the dish when your ace pitching isn't exactly a new thing, guys. Why get worked up over it now?

Because why have TWO of those guys? They traded for Montero and accepted his massive contract because he is a top notch defensive catcher. There's no reason Jon Lester needs a personal catcher wasting a spot they very obviously need for another bench player when they already have Montero on the roster.

Like I said, this isn't Maddux not wanting to throw to Michael Barrett, a moron and shitty defensive catcher. This is choosing a catcher who isn't even as good behind the plate as your regular starter, and who takes up a spot that could go to someone who could actually pinch it.

Isn't this, basically, what Castillo is right now?  With all the positional flexibility on the rest of the roster, Castillo is a guy who can pinch hit.  Woo hoo!  I don't understand what roster spot Ross is wasting.  They need a backup catcher no matter what, right?  If that backup catcher is Castillo, they'd need another "someone who could actually pinch hit".  I don't understand...

Well golly why have two guys capable of pinch hitting when you have one!

How often will your backup catcher pinch hit in a close game?  I'm thinking most of the time he's held back in case something happens to the starter, right?  For fuck's sake, he's a goddamn backup catcher!

I'm all for firebarning those who deserve it (fuck you, Blake Dewitt).  But, jebus...let's everyone just calm down!!!!!

Adding kindling.

Well why did they sign 2015 David Ross if 2011 David Ross was available?

No shit. Let's go out and sign 2011 Lance Berkman and his .959 OPS to come off the bench and pinch-hit. He's available, after all.

I'm still getting over the logic of "why not turn the positive of a backup catcher who can hit into a negative by adding a second no-hit backup catcher at the expense of a position player who might be able to hit?"

Oleg does have a valid point about backup catchers generally not being used as pinch-hitters. If Montero & Castillo are the only catchers on the roster, Beef probably does not pinch-hit in these last 3 games. Then again, Maddon likes to take nice soft poops on conventional baseball wisdom, so who knows.

True, but they're in a situation right now where Travis Wood has had to pinch hit because their bench is so short. When a roster spot they actually need is taken up by a guy they don't need, I get angry at that guy. I never said it was fair or rational but Ross sucks so I feel pretty safe up here, steering this hatewagon.

I hated Koyie Hill, too. It's good times when the guy that's most hateable on the roster is the backup catcher, because that means you have depth elsewhere, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't hate people. Hate's what makes life worth livin, folks.


I mean, just for a hypothetical let's say the Cubs have the best player at every single position. Stanton, Cabrera, Trout, etc. they're all Cubs. The team wins 118 games, but for some reason 200 at bats that year go to Aaron Miles. There's no real need for Aaron Miles to be on the roster. He's just there because he's bros with Stanton or some shit. So you gotta watch him waddle up there and hit .109 for 190 ABs when you know, by God, you shouldn't have to.

You gonna tell me there's no Firebarn thread on this here blog for him? Eh?

Yeah, fuck that guy for taking up a roster spot.  When the Cubs offered him a contract and a spot on the 25-man, he should have told them to cram it.  "I'm not good enough, so you cunts can take your financial security for my family and FUCK RIGHT OFF."