Fuck It's Silent in Here 2016

[flannj]

You and your moderate republican friends are losing solely because you refuse to admit out loud, with the facts very loudly staring you in the face, that spending 8 years slowly stoking the fires of birthers and paranoid fears that Obama is a secret muslim who wants to take your guns was a bad idea and it created a base of radicals you can't control.

I don't know how we got here, but I want to elope with this SKOpost.

Me too.

Also, TJ. Come on out into the great wide world of Independence with me. It feels so good not to have to defend any of these assclowns ever again. And I even started going back to church after like 25 years of atheism/agnosticism/devil worship. It's right here for you man. It doesn't make you a quitter. Far from it.

Independence is admirable, but are you suggesting I just surrender the controls of AA Flight 11 peacefully and let the Trumpers take it into the North Tower without a fight? At least right now, you have Kasich and Rubio and even Carson and Cruz from which to choose.

I am interested to hear more about your return to church sometime in person, preferably in between pitches. I won't even wear tasseled loafers

The best outcome for Republicans might be that the party splinters. The wackos leave, moderate Republicans resume control, and perhaps pull in a lot of the moderate independents and conservative minorities who are currently unwelcome in the GOP.

A Hillary presidency would seem to be a boon for somebody because disaffected voters will turn where they will. Moderate Republicans though? I mean, they'd have to centerist, realists and inclusive to offset the Tea/Trump Partiers. Those people would seem to be kind of ok with whatever Hillary has cooking. Liberal Democrats who support Bernie and at once belived in Obama/Change/Hope/BLACKPRESIDENTZOMG are not going that way. There aren't enough rich people left, the upper middle class is evaporating. That ship has sailed.

So to answer TJ's question, yes. I think he should let the plane fly into the mountain. If he wants to stick around and hope for a miracle, ok... I'll still be here with my growing group of friends when he's ready. I'll have some scissors for the loafers too. Snip-snip, problem over.

Someone show me anyone currently in the Republican party that's willing to vote for Hillary.

If 8 years of Obama gave us Trump, I can't imagine what 4-8 years of Hillary is going to spawn. 

For years, the big knock on the Clintons was their whole "triangulation" method of government. They are populists, which makes them centrists/moderates. I truly believe that Republicans who won't back Trump in the primaries, who are alarmed by his candidacy and rise to relevance would certainly either stay home on Election Day or cast a vote for Hillary over Trump. Certainly they'd vote for Hillary over Bernie.

They, like all currently running aren't populists / moderates / centrists or whatever political flavor of the day you want to label them with.
None of them.
They are ego driven politicians first, foremost and always.

This isn't about policy. They don't care about you.
Just get elected baby.

[flannj]

For the record I'm not even a Bernie supporter, but the condescending attitude that my generation either A) "only wants free shit or B)Doesn't actually know what socialism is really annoys the piss out of me.

Look at the current economic situation for most of my generation, the jobs available, the housing market, and really ask why the hell they wouldn't drift toward socialism.

It's not just your generation.
And I say this honestly with three kids just about your age.

Right. I went for an archivist job a few years back. It was an entry level position. I was one of the finalists, but I lost out to a guy who got the job because he'd been laid off from his other archivist position and had 15+ years of experience.

I sure as hell can't compete with 15+ years of experience for a position like that, and the company just gets to laugh all of the way to the bank because that poor sonofabitch is forced to work at an entry level salary despite all of his experience. They win, and both of us lose, and that includes the one who got the damn job. Is it any real question as to why people are drifting toward literally anything other than what we've done for 30+ years?

It's not because we're lazy and entitled, that's for damn sure.

Agreed. And what exactly is the POTUS or Congress or Mike Madigan or Tammy Duckworth or Mark Kirk any other douchebag politician going to do about it?
Zilch.
And presuming they were competent, should that be their job?
(ht Chuck)

[Canadouche]

You and your moderate republican friends are losing solely because you refuse to admit out loud, with the facts very loudly staring you in the face, that spending 8 years slowly stoking the fires of birthers and paranoid fears that Obama is a secret muslim who wants to take your guns was a bad idea and it created a base of radicals you can't control.

I don't know how we got here, but I want to elope with this SKOpost.

Me too.

Also, TJ. Come on out into the great wide world of Independence with me. It feels so good not to have to defend any of these assclowns ever again. And I even started going back to church after like 25 years of atheism/agnosticism/devil worship. It's right here for you man. It doesn't make you a quitter. Far from it.

Independence is admirable, but are you suggesting I just surrender the controls of AA Flight 11 peacefully and let the Trumpers take it into the North Tower without a fight? At least right now, you have Kasich and Rubio and even Carson and Cruz from which to choose.

I am interested to hear more about your return to church sometime in person, preferably in between pitches. I won't even wear tasseled loafers

The best outcome for Republicans might be that the party splinters. The wackos leave, moderate Republicans resume control, and perhaps pull in a lot of the moderate independents and conservative minorities who are currently unwelcome in the GOP.

A Hillary presidency would seem to be a boon for somebody because disaffected voters will turn where they will. Moderate Republicans though? I mean, they'd have to centerist, realists and inclusive to offset the Tea/Trump Partiers. Those people would seem to be kind of ok with whatever Hillary has cooking. Liberal Democrats who support Bernie and at once belived in Obama/Change/Hope/BLACKPRESIDENTZOMG are not going that way. There aren't enough rich people left, the upper middle class is evaporating. That ship has sailed.

So to answer TJ's question, yes. I think he should let the plane fly into the mountain. If he wants to stick around and hope for a miracle, ok... I'll still be here with my growing group of friends when he's ready. I'll have some scissors for the loafers too. Snip-snip, problem over.

Someone show me anyone currently in the Republican party that's willing to vote for Hillary.

If 8 years of Obama gave us Trump, I can't imagine what 4-8 years of Hillary is going to spawn. 

For years, the big knock on the Clintons was their whole "triangulation" method of government. They are populists, which makes them centrists/moderates. I truly believe that Republicans who won't back Trump in the primaries, who are alarmed by his candidacy and rise to relevance would certainly either stay home on Election Day or cast a vote for Hillary over Trump. Certainly they'd vote for Hillary over Bernie.

They, like all currently running aren't populists / moderates / centrists or whatever political flavor of the day you want to label them with.
None of them.
They are ego driven politicians first, foremost and always.

This isn't about policy. They don't care about you.
Just get elected baby.

No doubt, but "do whatever it takes" is often reflected by appealing to the largest group of people. The Clintons poll (or in Bill's case "pole") the shit out of Americans and doing what gets them the biggest political win. This isn't necessarily the best way to govern, but it means that popular initiatives will get accomplished, and she's safer than Trump.

[CBStew]

I just don't believe Trump has won over anyone who wasn't already against Obama, and he's ensured the moderates who would usually be fooled by previous GOP euphemisms will probably not vote for him.

I mean the difference between Trump and the previous GOP candidates is that he just says out loud all of the stuff they've merely implied. Previous candidates will say they need to "strengthen the border", Trump will just come out and say they need to do it because Mexicans are drug pushers and rapists. He hasn't added to the GOP base, he's just empowered them to say out loud all the stuff they were thinking, and stolen them from the GOP guys who hid behind comfortable euphemisms.

Conversely, what Obama did for the Democratic base, bringing huge numbers of Blacks into the electorate for the first time ever is unlikely to continue for Clinton. We'll have to hope that the anti-Trump center turns out for her (and not someone else yet to be determined) in the battleground states we've mentioned.

And I disagree with the notion that Trump is not bringing people into the party who were disconnected previously. There are poor whites everywhere who don't vote and he's got their attention.

Clinton seems to be doing very, very well among minorities so far in the primaries, and while mobilizing them for Clinton might be difficult, it's easier if you think of it as mobilizing them against Trump. It would be easy to show them Trump's twitter page, the videos of his supporters attacking black people, and refuse to let the whole "Trump likes the KKK thing" die.

I just think that Trump basically has the Angry White People vote and that's it. Angry White People were already doing everything they could to vote against Obama and lost, and the "poor whites" that Trump is getting to turn out are mostly doing so in states that are already red states.

She's attracting the minority voters more than Sanders, of course, but I haven't seen anyone publish numbers on how many people are voting in the Democratic primary this time around, as opposed to in 2008. What I have noticed is that, so far, more Republicans are voting in the primaries than Democrats.

Hot off the press:

http://dailycaller.com/2016/03/02/democratic-turnout-down-32-in-super-tuesday-states-compared-to-2008/

Trump on the ballot in November would bring out yuuuge numbers of Democratic voters for Hilary.

[CBStew]

If the Republican establishment manages to get someone other than Trump nominated, I believe that it is likely that Trump will run as a third party candidate.  He has almost promised to do so.

[flannj]

You and your moderate republican friends are losing solely because you refuse to admit out loud, with the facts very loudly staring you in the face, that spending 8 years slowly stoking the fires of birthers and paranoid fears that Obama is a secret muslim who wants to take your guns was a bad idea and it created a base of radicals you can't control.

I don't know how we got here, but I want to elope with this SKOpost.

Me too.

Also, TJ. Come on out into the great wide world of Independence with me. It feels so good not to have to defend any of these assclowns ever again. And I even started going back to church after like 25 years of atheism/agnosticism/devil worship. It's right here for you man. It doesn't make you a quitter. Far from it.

Independence is admirable, but are you suggesting I just surrender the controls of AA Flight 11 peacefully and let the Trumpers take it into the North Tower without a fight? At least right now, you have Kasich and Rubio and even Carson and Cruz from which to choose.

I am interested to hear more about your return to church sometime in person, preferably in between pitches. I won't even wear tasseled loafers

The best outcome for Republicans might be that the party splinters. The wackos leave, moderate Republicans resume control, and perhaps pull in a lot of the moderate independents and conservative minorities who are currently unwelcome in the GOP.

A Hillary presidency would seem to be a boon for somebody because disaffected voters will turn where they will. Moderate Republicans though? I mean, they'd have to centerist, realists and inclusive to offset the Tea/Trump Partiers. Those people would seem to be kind of ok with whatever Hillary has cooking. Liberal Democrats who support Bernie and at once belived in Obama/Change/Hope/BLACKPRESIDENTZOMG are not going that way. There aren't enough rich people left, the upper middle class is evaporating. That ship has sailed.

So to answer TJ's question, yes. I think he should let the plane fly into the mountain. If he wants to stick around and hope for a miracle, ok... I'll still be here with my growing group of friends when he's ready. I'll have some scissors for the loafers too. Snip-snip, problem over.

Someone show me anyone currently in the Republican party that's willing to vote for Hillary.

If 8 years of Obama gave us Trump, I can't imagine what 4-8 years of Hillary is going to spawn. 

For years, the big knock on the Clintons was their whole "triangulation" method of government. They are populists, which makes them centrists/moderates. I truly believe that Republicans who won't back Trump in the primaries, who are alarmed by his candidacy and rise to relevance would certainly either stay home on Election Day or cast a vote for Hillary over Trump. Certainly they'd vote for Hillary over Bernie.

They, like all currently running aren't populists / moderates / centrists or whatever political flavor of the day you want to label them with.
None of them.
They are ego driven politicians first, foremost and always.

This isn't about policy. They don't care about you.
Just get elected baby.

No doubt, but "do whatever it takes" is often reflected by appealing to the largest group of people. The Clintons poll (or in Bill's case "pole") the shit out of Americans and doing what gets them the biggest political win. This isn't necessarily the best way to govern, but it means that popular initiatives will get accomplished, and she's safer than Trump.

It's not about "governing" or popular initiatives. It's about getting elected.
And once in office the only policy they care about enacting is the one that's going to get them elected next term.
If popularity dictated that Hillary should become a Juggalette she'd fucking do it.

There's a visual for you.

[SKO]

Of all the shocking things to come from this thread I think the most surprising is that Flannj knows what the hell a juggalette is.

[Quality Start Machine]

Of all the shocking things to come from this thread I think the most surprising is that Flannj knows what the hell a juggalette is.

Flannj is down with the clown.

[SKO]

Of all the shocking things to come from this thread I think the most surprising is that Flannj knows what the hell a juggalette is.

Flannj is down with the clown.

Flannj is just glad somebody finally sympathizes with his confusion about magnets.

[flannj]

Of all the shocking things to come from this thread I think the most surprising is that Flannj knows what the hell a juggalette is.

Flannj is down with the clown.

Flannj is just glad somebody finally sympathizes with his confusion about magnets.

Sometimes this bald old man has got to flash a wicked clown.

[Shooter]

Trump appeals to the stupid, something this country has a nearly endless supply of. I was hoping they were too stupid to figure out how to register to vote and when to show up to vote, but that is proving not to be true. He makes shit up (The Daily Show played a clip of him claiming the unemployment rate was as high as 42%), and his supporters don't hear (or care to hear) the actual facts. Given the widespread distaste for Hillary (even from the left), I won't be comfortable until all of the ballots are counted.

[flannj]

Trump appeals to the stupid, something this country has a nearly endless supply of. I was hoping they were too stupid to figure out how to register to vote and when to show up to vote, but that is proving not to be true. He makes shit up (The Daily Show played a clip of him claiming the unemployment rate was as high as 42%), and his supporters don't hear (or care to hear) the actual facts. Given the widespread distaste for Hillary (even from the left), I won't be comfortable until all of the ballots are counted.

Low information voters or those who choose to be low information voters.

In other words as you said, stupid.

[Bort]

Trump appeals to the stupid, something this country has a nearly endless supply of. I was hoping they were too stupid to figure out how to register to vote and when to show up to vote, but that is proving not to be true. He makes shit up (The Daily Show played a clip of him claiming the unemployment rate was as high as 42%), and his supporters don't hear (or care to hear) the actual facts. Given the widespread distaste for Hillary (even from the left), I won't be comfortable until all of the ballots are counted.

You probably mean "especially," because she has never been close to a leftist in her entire career, despite the mad fantasies of the Right.

[Saul Goodman]

You and your moderate republican friends are losing solely because you refuse to admit out loud, with the facts very loudly staring you in the face, that spending 8 years slowly stoking the fires of birthers and paranoid fears that Obama is a secret muslim who wants to take your guns was a bad idea and it created a base of radicals you can't control.

I don't know how we got here, but I want to elope with this SKOpost.

I might need the concept of "loudly" staring facts explained, but other than that it's hard to argue with. And yeah, the GOP is a 757 with "TRUMP" emblazoned on the fuselage in a steep nosedive that's about to bury itself into the dirt at about 700 mph. Did I mention both engines are on fire?

[Quality Start Machine]

Trump appeals to the stupid, something this country has a nearly endless supply of. I was hoping they were too stupid to figure out how to register to vote and when to show up to vote, but that is proving not to be true. He makes shit up (The Daily Show played a clip of him claiming the unemployment rate was as high as 42%), and his supporters don't hear (or care to hear) the actual facts. Given the widespread distaste for Hillary (even from the left), I won't be comfortable until all of the ballots are counted.

Low information voters or those who choose to be low information voters.

In other words as you said, stupid.

Don't think it's "low information" as much as "specific information". Finding only items fitting into their worldview, so they aren't being informed as much as feeling informed.